From: blakes7-d-request@lysator.liu.se Subject: blakes7-d Digest V98 #160 X-Loop: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se X-Mailing-List: archive/volume98/160 Precedence: list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/digest; boundary="----------------------------" To: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se Reply-To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se ------------------------------ Content-Type: text/plain blakes7-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 160 Today's Topics: [B7L] Nicola's big news Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? [B7L] B7 characters as drinks (was Fourth season -why?) Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? [B7L] Mountain Media Con Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Re: [B7L] B7L re Avon Re: [B7L] Orac and Fourth Season Re: [B7L] The Rise & Fall of Roj Blake and the Spiders from Gauda Prime Re: [B7L] Gan Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Fwd: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Re: [B7L] Fourth Season Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? [B7L] dissertations Re: [B7L] B7L re Avon Re: [B7L] Fourth Season Re: [B7L] Fourth Season ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 09:46:28 +1200 From: Nicola Collie To: space-city@world.std.com, B7-list , spin list Subject: [B7L] Nicola's big news Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" One thing that's true of kiwis (the birds) is that they're flightless. P'raps because of this, one characteristic of Kiwis (the humans) is an urge to do the big OE*. Anyway, for this Kiwi the time is coming when I'll say goodbye to the South Pacific for a couple of years, and explore another pond on the other side of the world. I'm delighted and excited to announce that, come November this year, I'll be making my nest in Leeds. Citizens of the UK - consider yourself warned ;-) ttfn, Nicola *overseas experience - a traditional rite of passage for young antipodeans. --- Nicola Collie Dunedin, New Zealand nicola.collie@stonebow.otago.ac.nz It just occurred to me that, as the description of a highly sophisticated technological achievement "Avon's gadget works" seems to lack a certain style. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 19:28:48 -0700 From: Pat Patera To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Message-ID: <357B4C60.6AFC@geocities.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Katrina Harkess wrote: > > I've just joined the list and I have to say I'm dismayed at some of the > comments on the fourth season. I have been in lurk mode for some time, but this thread has roused me from my slumber. 4th season has an undertone of darkness and danger that all the others lack. There's no ocean-liner Liberator to speed them from danger. No benevolent Zen watching over them. In 4th season they face real peril. The blow to the Federation is in itself a moral lesson: tyranny is bad, but might not anarchy be worse? > In particular Assasin - From my point of view it was one of Soolin's best > episodes And, featuring the Golden Goddess of Guns, Soolin, that made it all worthwhile > Piri/Cancer was a bit bad. It was the acting I think, not the lines,... I think the actress did a great job. Yes, Piri was annoying, but she was *supposed* to be. She wanted to put everyone's nerves on edge - and she sure did mine! I was *so* glad when she turned into Cancer. And what a mahvelous villan Cancer was. Surely a woman who worked such an "edgy" profession would be flamboyant during those moments she came out of hiding. As flamboyant as Servalan: I expect that's why Servie liked her. And indeed, Servie *did* like Cancer - even called her "a credit to our sex". (I can't remember Servalan ever honestly complimenting anyone else). I like to imagine the two of them, chummy at the bar, laughing over their past atrocities, each trying to top the other, aka guys' playing at one upmanship. Oh! To be a fly on the wall during that round of girltalk! > Rob wrote: >... From what I've seen of Soolin, I'm >beginning to think they may have had the latter right under their noses. Soolin was a stong personality, but could never take the place of Blake, for she is cold while Blake was hot. Avon is cold. Vila is lukewarm. It was the crackling cold of Avon hissing against the heat of Blake that made the dynamics so sorely missed when Blake was gone. Tarrant and Dayna are neither hot nor cold - more like fizzy pop - cute and colorful and sweet, but without the heat to make ice cubes snap and crack. (Here is where I suggest a new game: if the B7 crew were drinks, what would each one be?) Blake: Guinness ale Avon: rum & coke (with lotsa ice) Vila: adreneline & soma :-) Jenna: Mai Tai Cally: Shirley Temple Tarrant: strawberry margarita Dayna: Kaluha & coffee (jumpy) Soolin: hot buttered rum Servalan: dry martini >But let's face it, Blake wasn't the only thing that was missing from >Series Four. The first series, which I'm watching again now it's out on >video, is littered with adult themes -- by that I mean moral shades of >grey and challenging ideas. Here too, I feel 4th season outranks 1&2. The grey areas of 4th season threaten to ensnare even our "good guys." When is it ok to steal? To lie? To betray? Judith scooped me on naming many of the good specific moral questions that arose. But starting with Dorian, the grey began: we eat many animals to live: so Dorian's creature needed to eat people to keep him alive. We are forced to examine our souls and think whether we would succumb to the life that Dorian did. Does life become more precious the long one possesses it? As Ensor said, "One clings." Finally, I adore the OTT villians of 4th season. Not a dull character among the bunch. I fervently hope that in the future, all people will feel free to be individuals, as far a cry as possible from the cookie cutter "Man in the Grey Flannel Suit" that the World War II vets became in the 50s. I can't stop! Plus, the storylines of 4th season are more intricate and convoluted than at the start, before Servalan began concocting plots hidden within plots. Both Gold and Games are like the Russian nestling dolls, one plot tucked away, hidden, inside another. ok, I'll stop - Pat Patera ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 16:03:15 +1200 From: Nicola Collie To: B7-list Subject: [B7L] B7 characters as drinks (was Fourth season -why?) Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Pat Patera: >(Here is where I suggest a new game: if the B7 crew were drinks, what >would each one be?) >Blake: Guinness ale >Avon: rum & coke (with lotsa ice) Dunno about coke - seems a bit sweet to me. How about single malt scotch, straight? Simple on the surface, but investigate further and you find subtle, sophisticated, interlacing one flavour after another... but a firey finish for the careless. This is the point where my libido refuses to stop suggesting exotic concoctions with ever-more suggestive names. ;-) >Vila: adreneline & soma :-) Of course :-) >Jenna: Mai Tai >Cally: Shirley Temple >Tarrant: strawberry margarita >Dayna: Kaluha & coffee (jumpy) >Soolin: hot buttered rum No opinion really. >Servalan: dry martini Definitely. Actually, I think Gan would be something substantial and sweet - like that rum and coke we mentioned earlier. Or maybe mulled wine. Warm, spicy and satisfying. And Orac would be ethylene glycol ;-) ttfn, Nicola --- Nicola Collie Dunedin, New Zealand nicola.collie@stonebow.otago.ac.nz It just occurred to me that, as the description of a highly sophisticated technological achievement "Avon's gadget works" seems to lack a certain style. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 15:50:06 +1000 From: "Christine Lacey" To: Subject: Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Message-Id: <199806080548.PAA07781@magna.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was really please to see Pat Patera's defence of 'Assassin', since it's an episode that I rather like and would regard as one of the better ones of series 4. Admittedly it had its crappy aspects, but hell, if you can't cope with some bad acting, silly costumes and ridiculous monsters, why watch B7? On the plus side, some of the dialogue is excellent. My favourites are: T: He's good then, this Cancer? A: You can imagine how it pains me to use the word 'infallible' T: Oh come on, Avon, no-one's infallible. A: Alright then, he's not infallible. It's just that he has never failed. And the bit on Cancer's ship, when Tarrant is doing his macho posturing bit: A: She knows that you are very brave. Now sit down. Of course, the best aspect of 'Assassin' is that Soolin gets a lot to do and comes out of it looking very good. I also think the episode says some rather nice things about gender stereotypes. Piri/Cancer manages to incorporate two female stereotypes - the pathetically wimpy and dependent twit, and the nasty, heartless, man-destroying bitch. This would be quite offensive to the female viewer, if it wasn't for the presence of Soolin, showing that women can actually be intelligent, reliable, independent and sensible. And sympathetic as well. I particularly appreciated how Soolin went out of her way to be nice to Neebrox. I got the impression she thought that a nice old codger who'd had a nasty time on a slave planet was more deserving of sympathy than a young, selfish girlie who ought to have been able to look after herself. Another relevant bit is when Soolin says angrily to Tarrant "When two men don't like each other that's a rational judgement. But if two women don't like each other it must be jealousy!" The role reversal toward the end is lovely too - the captive hero tied up and awaiting a horrible fate, rescued at the last moment by our brave, gun-wielding heroine. I'll stop rambling now and go back into lurk mode :) Christine ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 07:06:59 EDT From: Mac4781@aol.com To: space-city@world.std.com, blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Mountain Media Con Message-ID: <8ab1c756.357bc5d4@aol.com> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit The wonderful women who produce Mountain Media Con (Denver media convention, July 24-26, 1998) asked me to pass along some information. Folks who have registered or who register soon will receive a Mountain Media Con tote bag in one of two colors as part of their membership packet. These are lovely and roomy totes, perfect for carrying loot at conventions, library books, etc. So if you plan to attend this year's con but haven't registered, you might want to send in your membership request now and qualify for a free tote. As I told everyone last year, the con is wonderful: beautiful setting, elegant hotel, interesting panels, three dealers rooms, tiered seating in the video room, and bountiful food in the con suite. Carol Mc ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 12:21:46 +0100 (BST) From: Rob Clother To: AChevron@aol.com cc: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > I believe the writers covered this in a line from Volcano. Avon is telling > the others that rumors of Blake are already flooding the Federation, and that > even at that point it would take them a lifetime to investigate them all. They had Orac to investigate them all. "An intelligent listening system for beginners". If Orac was able to track Blake down 5-10 years after his disappearance, why wasn't he able to do so immediately afterwards? > Without fairly hard evidence, it wouldn't make sense to chase each rumor, > especially when Blake could always contact them if he really wanted finding. He did want finding. "Avon, I was waiting for you." Also, given Blake's comment, "Most of what happened to me wasn't on Earth", as well as what we know did happen to him on Earth, we can assume that he had to endure some horrific ordeals during his separation from his crew. The fact that they weren't there for it doesn't reflect well on them -- but then if they were angels they wouldn't have been anything like as interesting. :-) > The season may not have had "direction", but I prefer this and the > opportunities it opened up for the series, and the characters, over 10-13 > episodes of "Drat, we just missed him again." The search for Star One worked. Terminal was a magnificent end to the season -- it would have been even more hard-hitting if it had followed three or four episodes which included at least a token reference to the search for Blake. CHeers, Rob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:24:44 +0930 From: "Ophelia" To: "B7 list" Subject: Re: [B7L] B7L re Avon Message-ID: <01bd92dc$9c29fde0$LocalHost@waltersmith> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I must admit, fashion criticism is my favourite B7 thread. It's also my favourite conversion device - "You have to watch this old show, honey, the costumes! Leather, vinyl, lame, studs, and this super-femme dictator in white sequins - you'll love it." Jenni wrote: <<. I though in Season 4 he looked a bit too "Dallas" for my taste - Airbrushed, over-made up, fluffy hair. found the pale faces and badly cut hair in the earlier seasons to be much more convincing for the situation they were all in. >> You've hit the nail firmly on its balding pate again, love. Merkin soap it is. I have *never* understood fen's affection for that 4ths season atrocity of a 'do. Puffy, mousy hair just isn't my thing, especially when looks like it has been subjected to so much hair lacquer and blow-drying it must feel like glue-coated wire. Urgh. Even though Avon's early 'do was hardly sophisticated and dashing, it at least it looked like some remnants of vitality were left in the follicles. Jenna's hair was bad, too - plentiful hair of a pretty colour, subjected to deadly chemicals and blasts of hot air. They should have taken Soolin's advice, of course. That lady really knew how to wield a crimping iron. Oh, well, at least it looked vaguely touchable, even if fake. (Vila's hair always looked nice and touchable, if thinning.) Iain also put fingertips to keyboard, or voice to microphone, to suggest: <> OK. Mmmmm.... Oh, sorry, were you saying something? <> Of course! You expect a genuine gunslinging goddess to sit around in the middle of barbarians without someone to deep-condition her golden locks and no-pain tone that pretty posterior? How on earth could she expect to get respect from pink-coifed aliens without some help? After all, she had ZeeZee to compete with. Not to mention *Tarrant*... << After three seasons of dashing around in an alien spacecraft, being shot, beaten, tortured, blown up and attacked by mystical cosmic superbeings, I guess the temptation was just too great.>> I think they learned from Servalan - you can get away with murder if your eyelashes are sufficiently thick. Jenni added: <> And don't you think that the thing in the basement should have been given a chance with the Autobeautytherapist?>> What, as punishment for Soolin's eye make-up? <> You darling innocent, you don't keep your beauty therapists in the basement. You share your closet. Cylan also took the time to write (of the techie one): <circumstances has he looked a 'prat'!>> Oh, but darling, go watch "Assassin" and "Power" again and reconsider. - XXX Lindley Ophelia - ophelia@picknowl.com.au "The girl has beauty, virtue, wit, Grace, humour, wisdom, charity and pluck." LONDON CALLING - a list to discuss Britcoms and knockwurst. http://www.geocities.com/TelevisionCity/2511/knockwurst.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:06:41 +0930 From: "Ophelia" To: Subject: Re: [B7L] Orac and Fourth Season Message-ID: <01bd92da$16dc3ce0$LocalHost@waltersmith> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Murray wrote: > I was very interested in Rob Clother's views on the fourth season >episodes. My worst episode is 'Power', with its portrayal of relations >between the sexes. It was obviously based on, and was almost as bad as, the >awful original Star Trek episode of 'Spock's Brain'. Yeah, but at least Spock's brain was piss-funny. "What is brain?" "Power" didn't even have that saving grace, although it's always amusing to see Avon get socked on the head. - XXX Lindley Ophelia - ophelia@picknowl.com.au "The girl has beauty, virtue, wit, Grace, humour, wisdom, charity and pluck." LONDON CALLING - a list to discuss Britcoms and knockwurst. http://www.geocities.com/TelevisionCity/2511/knockwurst.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:35:35 +0930 From: "Ophelia" To: Subject: Re: [B7L] The Rise & Fall of Roj Blake and the Spiders from Gauda Prime Message-ID: <01bd92de$203cea60$LocalHost@waltersmith> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Helen K wrote: >> I'm not doing favourite songs as much >> as matching songs to personalities/life >> stories, in this post. >Well, actually, that was basically what I was trying to do, too. :^/ >You're on to me. Great minds and all that... >> >Blake: "Heroes" (naturally) >> >> Hmm. I'd have " "heroes" " (see, I can >> punctuate Bowie titles! Who said a liberal >> arts education was a waste of time?) >Not me... I discovered Bowie in college! Definitely worth while then. I discovered Bowie cos my Nanna took me to see "Labyrinth" when I was a kid. But I lost my tape with >"heroes" so I forgot how it was punctuated. The new cover punctuates it wrong. WRONG I tell you! And the lead singer dfeson't even cry in the vid! What has the world come to?! "The guns >fired above our heads-- all around us--" Hmm if Blake had kissed Avon, >it would be perfect. No, it wouldn't. Vila's feelings would have been hurt. re "Let's Dance": >I guess I'm so terminally depressed I thought of its nihilism as >mainstreaam.. I _do_ know it's not really a happy song, but rather a >carpe diem. And why must the romance be empty? 'Cos the writer was a coke-head? Btw, the film-clip - about the survival and pride of Australian aborigines against all odds - interprets the words *very* differently - against the grain, I thought, but that's me. Love is frightening. You >invest so much of your soul in it, the thought of losing the other >becomes terrifying, even if not based on anything but the insability of >life in general. Ooh, that's beautiful. >> Gan's difficult - even when Bowie is most >> mainstream, he's not very mainstream :-P >> Somehow, I'm thinking of "Starman," >That fits. "There's a Starman, wating in the sky, he'd like to come nd >join us, but he thinks he'd blow our minds"... Gan did try to get the >others on Cygnus Alpha to accept Blake and back his plans. *Very* good... >> >Jenna: "Ashes to Ashes" or "Major Tom" >Ashes to Ashes is kind of a sequel to Major Tom, plus there's an >anti-drug message, and you know how she felt about Shadow. I like that. I found Jenna's resistance to Shadow very cool - the principled criminal is always an attractive character. >Maybe also fitting because her character was kept in the background too >much, Like most of the intriguing ones... or a reflection of her feelings about life before Blake's >rebellion. "I've never done good things. I've never done bad things. I >never did anything out of the blue." Excellent. I've never really thought of her that way - when I think of Jenna's past, I tend to obsess over her mother - but, yeah, fame and all, she was just a crim on a bigger scale than Vila. >I haven't listened to my Bowie collection often enough lately. >> >> John: >> >> <> >> >And I am absolutely enchanted with the idea of "Let's Dance" for him, >now that I listened to it again. >"And if you say run, I'll run with you. >And if you say hide, we'll hide..." LOL. >> My idea for Cally is probably >> "Loving the Alien." Not just because >> it's an irresistibly bad pun, but because >> I can see her "praying to an empty sky" >> while fighting for her cause regardless.. >Mine too. I thought of it after my post, and slapped my head for missing >it earlier. Repeat comment aboutr great minds. - XXX Lindley Ophelia - ophelia@picknowl.com.au "The girl has beauty, virtue, wit, Grace, humour, wisdom, charity and pluck." LONDON CALLING - a list to discuss Britcoms and knockwurst. http://www.geocities.com/TelevisionCity/2511/knockwurst.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:04:03 +0930 From: "Ophelia" To: "Lysator List" Subject: Re: [B7L] Gan Message-ID: <01bd92d9$b8586040$LocalHost@waltersmith> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Judith points out, compellingly, what a damned nice and brave person our poor neglected Gan is. Hmmph. I might even graciously forgive her clearly misguided opinion that Vila is only "kind of cute." He's blanking adorable, womyn. She adds, re Gan & Horizon: >It's an interesting exchange. Gan accepts that they might have to open fire >with him still on board and he accepts that risk because he wishes to help >people whom he believes to be in danger. > >Would any of the others have volunteered in such a situation? Speaking for Soolin, not on your nelly. Vila, however, would have gone over in a buzz and saved the crew single-handedly, sacrificing his last fur cloak to cloak her last attacker's bloodstained wounds as he forgivingly nursed him back to health. And he wouldn't have complained about a thing, neither. - XXX Lindley Ophelia - ophelia@picknowl.com.au "The girl has beauty, virtue, wit, Grace, humour, wisdom, charity and pluck." LONDON CALLING - a list to discuss Britcoms and knockwurst. http://www.geocities.com/TelevisionCity/2511/knockwurst.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 09:20:16 EDT From: AChevron@aol.com To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Message-ID: <86b99684.357be511@aol.com> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 98-06-08 01:56:45 EDT, you write: << I'll stop rambling now and go back into lurk mode :) >> Please don't! This was a marvoulous defense of an episode I'm rather fond of. It's another case of where the women in B7 come off better than the men, whether for evil or good. Would love to see your take on other episodes...... Deborah Rose ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 09:45:20 EDT From: AChevron@aol.com To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Fwd: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Message-ID: Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part0_897313520_boundary" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --part0_897313520_boundary Content-ID: <0_897313520@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII --part0_897313520_boundary Content-ID: <0_897313520@inet_out.mail.aol.com.2> Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline From: AChevron@aol.com Return-path: To: rob@amsta.leeds.ac.uk Subject: Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 09:40:19 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 98-06-08 07:20:56 EDT, you write: << Terminal was a magnificent end to the season -- it would have been even more hard-hitting if it had followed three or four episodes which included at least a token reference to the search for Blake. >> I'm not sure you meant for this to reach me privately; if you intended to post it on the list, let me know and I'll forward it. It's a very good 'rebuttal' of some of my statements, but you'll forgive me if I answer back a few of your points.:) Orac was able to track down Blake using a method never mentioned before, a couple of years after Blake's disappearance. I suspect that the method is similar to the one he uses in predicting the DSV's destruction in 'Orac.' This involves Orac activively influencing the events, in order to lead to the predicted outcome. I think Avon (and for that matter Blake when he was around) recognized the dangers of utilizing Orac this way, and avoided it until temptation and desperation got the better of Orac. immediatley after the war, no doubt reports of Blake's presence swamped the communications lines. And if Blake were actually on a primitive planet, without Tariel technology, Orac's search would not find anything out until too late. I expect that Avon did check out a few leads from time to time, but we simply don't see them. It's not like Avon is ready to admit how badly he wants to find Blake, after all the verbal jousting he did with the man. Horrific things did happen to Blake, but I can't see blaming Avon et al for it. In Aftermath, Avon specifically programs Zen to rescue any of the others who indicate a higher need, indicating a deep concern for them. Given that, Blake is responcible for his own fate. And Jenna could always have called(with Blake threatened, she'd do anything, I think, to rescue him). This is a matter of Blake knowing Avon was looking for him, and avoiding contact until he'd arranged matters so that the two would meet on Blake's terms. An understandable attitude. Avon after all has been giving the Federation heck, while Blake has all but disappeared. The tragedy is that both Blake and Avon had their pre-concieved notions of what the reunion would be like, and when it didn't match their expectations, bad things happened. I agree, the search for Star One worked, but barely, in my eyes. It was reaching the point of "all right already" when they wisely concluded it. And I think the end of Terminal is that much more emotional for not having constantly thrown Blake's name about; at first we wonder what Avon is up to, then get this sudden insight as to how much Blake means to Avon. Also, if they had used the chase thread, we would have had to have seen an unconvincing concern on the part of Dayna and Tarrant for a man they'd never met. Dayna's loyalties are firmly with Avon, and Tarrant could always have joined the Resistance prior to Aftermath if he'd really deen of that bend. Nice talking,m sorry to be so long-winded. As I said, let me know, and I'll forward the post(and this responce, if you want) to the Lysator list. Deborah Rose --part0_897313520_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 14:52:00 +0100 From: "Alison Page" To: "Lysator" Subject: Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I absolutely love the first couple of episodes of B7, and I think Star One would have been a brilliant final ep if they hadn't had any more. But nevertheless I think B7 continued to be smashing in the 3rd and 4th seasons, because it got more 'knowing' - that is the writers and actors and all started to realise the effect they were having and played up to it. Now, I like that, though I can understand why others wouldn't. In fact as a teenager I couldn't believe how these people were playing it up so blatantly, and it still gives me a thrill. As if they are involving the audience. It is kind of camp, but an inclusive rather than a 'keep out' kind of camp. Like 'check this out kids!' I was watching 'Warlord' on UK gold last week. My companion on that occasion was saying: 'They could be getting on with all kinds of useful work on the base, but look - Dayna and Vila are just messing about, Tarrant is off shagging, and Soolin keeps complaining and sulking' And that just sums it up for me, why I like it so much. Alison ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 14:59:23 +0100 (BST) From: Iain Coleman To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Fourth Season Message-Id: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Fri, 5 Jun 1998, Julia Jones wrote: > In message , Iain > Coleman writes > > > > >This line might work on Una, but she's weird. I'm afraid I find the > >Dayna/Justin bit so irredeemably shit that even Jackie Pearce turning it > >up to 11 in this one cannot save the episode. > > It works a bit better if you try and imagine Dayna as Cally. This is one > of the episodes where it is horribly, horribly obvious that they had > started writing scripts with the assumption that Cally would still be > present, and didn't always have time to rewrite properly. It's also one of those episodes where it's horribly, horribly obvious that Jan Chappell was a far better actor than Josette Simon. The scripting in those scenes is bad enough, but the non-performances from Simon and the guest star whose name has mercifully erased itself from my mind are so brain-buggeringly awful that I cannot watch them without attempting severe self-mutilation in a desperate existential cry for aid from an uncaring cosmos. > > And at least if it had been Cally, Justin wouldn't be so obviously > guilty of the crime Blake was framed with... If it had been first season Cally, maybe she would have just shot the tosser and put him and the audience out of their misery. > > > >Oh, I _love_ Egrorian. Outrageously OTT, of course, but then he is a mad > >genius who's been stuck on some remote base for years with only Pindar for > >company. Is it any wonder he's a bit gaga? Comedy of the grotesque, mate, > >ye canny whack it. > > Ah, but when they were first stuck on that base, pre the Hoffel's > readiation accident, Pindar's charms were rather more obvious - it isn't > *quite* spelt out, but it is made fairly obvious that it was not merely > Pindar's mind that interested Egrorian :) Not quite spelt out? I thought it was declared in mile-high neon letters with an accompanying brass band and firework display. Iain ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 02:11:58 +0930 From: "Ophelia" To: Subject: Re: [B7L] Fourth Season - why?? Message-ID: <01bd92fc$5a863280$38a226cb@waltersmith> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Nice to see some of us speaking up for the fourth season. It has its frustrations, but it remains my favourite season, and contains some of my most-watched episodes - "Orbit"," "Gold," "Games," "Assassin," "Sand," "Warlord." None of the other seasons have the same seductively dark atmosphere - our "heroes" are now more criminals than heroes, and any "rebellion" they are putting up is more of an increasingly random and futile collection of powerless gestures against their slowly descending fate. And instead of organising, they run off on one ill-fated scheme after another, and spend most of their time bickering. As Pat beautifully pointed out, by this point there is *nothing* but grey. Avon and Soolin in particular are increasingly willing to select the darkest alternative, too, in a way not possible with Blake, Gan or Cally around. And then they die, stupidly and uselessly, because they were dumb enough and bad tempered enough to ignore their own computer. Beautiful. And, of course, Cally, who I liked very much up to S-L-D but who got on my nerves once she stopped being a suicidal terrorist and became a caring mystic, was replaced by the holy one herself. Soolin endlessly fascinates me - I can watch any episode in which she gets a moment of sun, simply concentrating on her complex reactions and interactions with the crew. And Cally's death itself sets the tone for the final series - no noble death like Gan's, urging Blake on, but a silly misjudgement, a terrified scream and a meaningless death. This ain't Star Trek... One last defence - Assassin is, in my opinion, a brilliant episode on many levels. Camp, more of the slavery system to ponder over, many of Soolin's best moments, Tarrant and Avon making prats of themselves because they're way too gullible about feminine stereotypes, a high femme bad lady and a very silly monster. Marvellous. - XXX Lindley Ophelia - ophelia@picknowl.com.au "The girl has beauty, virtue, wit, Grace, humour, wisdom, charity and pluck." LONDON CALLING - a list to discuss Britcoms and knockwurst. http://www.geocities.com/TelevisionCity/2511/knockwurst.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:09:30 +0100 (BST) From: Judith Proctor To: Lysator List Subject: [B7L] dissertations Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII In the light of the discussions provoked a few months back by the guy researching Blake's 7 at university and wanting to contact people who'd worked on the series etc., I though you might find the reverse situation amusing. I had a request for help yesterday from someone doing a dissertation on fanzines. Not that unusual, except that his dad was script editor on the series. It's a small world. Judith -- http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 Redemption 99 - The Blakes 7/Babylon 5 convention 26-28 February 1999, Ashford International Hotel, Kent http://www.smof.com/redemption/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 19:21:24 +0100 From: Julia Jones To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] B7L re Avon Message-ID: In message <01bd92dc$9c29fde0$LocalHost@waltersmith>, Ophelia writes >Cylan also took the time to write >(of the techie one): > ><>circumstances has he looked a 'prat'!>> > >Oh, but darling, go watch "Assassin" >and "Power" again and reconsider. > Power? What do you mean Power? That's a *wonderful* episode for those of us who enjoy seeing Avon knocked unconscious, dragged around, slung over some hulking great brute's shoulder... Is a prat, yes, looks a prat, no. The plot may be crap, but the visuals are stunning. -- Julia Jones "Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!" The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 19:28:25 +0100 From: Julia Jones To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Fourth Season Message-ID: In message , Iain Coleman writes > > >Not quite spelt out? I thought it was declared in mile-high neon letters >with an accompanying brass band and firework display. > They didn't quite script it as "What a pity Pinder had that little accident, I don't feel like shagging him any more, but I quite fancy that bit of stuff you've brought with you." Even if it was blatently obvious that that was the general idea. It was technically possible for the BBC to deny that that was what they had intended, it's just the National Viewers and Listeners Association collective dirty mind. -- Julia Jones "Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!" The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 23:26:58 +0100 From: "Alison Page" To: Subject: Re: [B7L] Fourth Season Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Julia says - > They didn't quite script it as "What a pity Pinder had that little > accident, I don't feel like shagging him any more, but I quite fancy > that bit of stuff you've brought with you." Can anybody think of another show where this would be an acceptable plot line? Particularly the way Vila doesn't mind a bit (until he realises Egrorian is not only mad and bad but dangerous to know). Alison -------------------------------- End of blakes7-d Digest V98 Issue #160 **************************************