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blakes7-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 29
Today's Topics:
[B7L] Bill Billingsley
[B7L] Submissions Wanted
Re: [B7L] Digest problems; nerds
Re: [B7L] Ragnorok (was B5 & B7)
[B7L] Costumes and nerds
[B7L] B5 & B7
Re: [B7L] B5 & B7
Re[2]: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
Re: [B7L] Cygnus Alpha 1/2
Re: [B7L] Cygnus Alpha 2/2
Re: Re[2]: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
Re: [B7L] B5 & B7
Re: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
Re: [B7L] B5 & B7
Re: Re[2]: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
[B7L] Cygnus Alpha Cult
Re: [B7L] sex/gender
[B7L] CHECKERS
[B7L] sex and SF
Re: [B7L] CHECKERS
[B7L] Blake and manipulation
Re: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
[B7L] Other species
[B7L] Horizon Letterzine
Re: [B7L] Blake and manipulation
Re: [B7L] B5 & B7
Re: [B7L] CHECKERS
[B7L] I HAVE RETURNED
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 12:41:00 -0800
From: "PATTI McCLELLAN" <patti.mcclellan@kyl.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Bill Billingsley
Message-ID: <Megw.4914106@powell.fabrik.com>
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I had a lovely (if far too short) visit with Bill while he was in
San Francisco. If he shows up at Pages, please tell him I said hello,
and how is he liking the zines. This young man is a credit to his age
group -- a gentleman with a great sense of humor, and the good sense
to be polite to a middle aged woman. I had so litle time available, I
felt guilty, and hope the rest of his trip is wonderful beyond belief
before he settles into working for a living.
Patti
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 14:23:22 MDT
From: "DAVID SANDERSON" <dsanders@alexandria.lib.utah.edu>
To: BLAKE7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Submissions Wanted
Message-ID: <BA5A249C@alexandria.lib.utah.edu>
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Greetings B7ers,
Egrorian Press is still looking for submissions for Tents of
Goth volume 2.
Tents of Goth is a general readership Blake's 7 fanzine. We are
looking for quality stories to put into our second volume. It is our
goal to put out the best magazine we possibly can. We want the
knowledgable fans on Lysator to be a good source for stories in our
magazine.
If you have any questions about our editorial policies or
submission guidelines visit our web site at:
http://choengmon.lib.utah.edu/~dsanders/egrorian/egrorian.html
or write me at:
dsanders@library.utah.edu
If you have any questions not covered by the web pages feel free
to write me at the address above.
Take care everyone,
David R. Sanderson
Managing Editor, Egrorian Press
David R. Sanderson Q. How many Vorlons does it
Programmer/Analyst take to change a lightbulb?
Marriott Library,
University of Utah A. Yes
Phone: (801) 581-5632
dsanders@library.utah.edu
DSS1@VM.USI.UTAH.EDU
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 20:11:04 +0000
From: Julia Jones <Julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Digest problems; nerds
Message-ID: <i0vYcDAYD5z0EwGe@jajones.demon.co.uk>
In message <199801280229.CAA29995@rock103.genie.net>,
s.thompson8@genie.geis.com writes
>
>Julia mentioned:
>
>>I was doing the colonisation period in school history classes when I
> >first saw CA - the parallel struck me at the time. Even if the
> >presentation was utterly naff. It's the wonky timeline in the episode
> >that really has me fascinated, and that's not just the question of what
> >B, J and A where doing for four months.
>
>Care to expand on that? What else besides the discrepancy in how long it
>took the convict ship to get to CA, and how long it took Liberator?
You've obviously missed the original post by Sue Clerc that started this
particular discussion. She explains it better than I would, so take a
look at that when someone sends you the digests. Baically to do with
serious discrepancies in the description of Cygnus Alpha's history.
>
>Julia also said:
>
>>Hmm. He did start as a nerd. Definitely a nerd. He might even have
> >stayed a nerd if he hadn't been played by an actor with ambitions to be
> >Clint Eastwood. I think it took Paul about one and a half episodes to
> >start noticably converting Avon into something slightly different.
>
>One of the funniest things in the first Trevor Hoyle novelization is that it
>was obviously written from some sort of preliminary script, before the
>actual casting had been done, and describes an exceedingly nerdly, homely
>Avon.
There are various other mismatches in description - in particular, he
got eye colours and hairstyles wrong for several of them. Probably the
only writer ever to describe Avon as having pale eyes :-)
Then there's the description of Jenna after she's found the clothing
store - "attired in the most magnificent -and revealing - space age
costume". Why would Avon think of it as space age?
>
>I don't know whether it was deliberate or not, but I really think it was a
>brilliant idea to have the computer geek played by a handsome and rather
>flamboyant actor. The unexpectedness of it is part of what makes the
>character so fascinating, IMO.
It certainly went against the "computer geek" stereotype of the time :-)
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 21:35:30 -0000
From: "Heather Smith" <Heather.Smith@btinternet.com>
To: "Blake's 7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Ragnorok (was B5 & B7)
Message-Id: <E0xxfGb-0000Yi-00@snow.btinternet.com>
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Reuben wrote:
> I am curious. Is Ragnorok just a Dr. Who reference (The Greatest Show
> in the Galaxy) or is it an actual mythical place?
Not a place, no. It's the Norse name for the last battle at the end of the
universe, good v. evil. According to myth, neither side wins, the major
heroes (insofar as there *are* heroes in Norse mythology) defeat the major
bad guys, only to die soon after from their own wounds. For example, Thor
(God of war, the one with the hammer), son of Odin defeats the great
serpent, but dies straight after from the poison from the serpents fangs.
Heather 'can't think of a clever quote to go here' Smith
'There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish'
-The fourth Doctor
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 10:59:31 +1300
From: Nicola Collie <nicola.collie@stonebow.otago.ac.nz>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Costumes and nerds
Message-Id: <l03102800b0f5592539bf@[139.80.16.149]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Julia writes:
>Then there's the description of Jenna after she's found the clothing
>store - "attired in the most magnificent -and revealing - space age
>costume". Why would Avon think of it as space age?
Perhaps he thought it looked dated :) - rather as the outfits of the
sixties and seventies look to our nineties eyes. "Space age" might equal
end of 20th, beginning of 21st century.
s.thompson8@genie.geis.com writes
>>I don't know whether it was deliberate or not, but I really think it was a
>>brilliant idea to have the computer geek played by a handsome and rather
>>flamboyant actor. The unexpectedness of it is part of what makes the
>>character so fascinating, IMO.
Works for me :)
ttfn, Nicola (girl-geek wannabe)
---
Nicola Collie nicola.collie@stonebow.otago.ac.nz
Dunedin, New Zealand
"It just occurred to me that, as the description of a highly sophisticated
technological achievement "Avon's gadget works," seems to lack a certain
style."
------------------------------
Date: 28 Jan 1998 14:14:45 -0800
From: "Buck, Courtney" <buck#m#_courtney@ssdgwy.mdc.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] B5 & B7
Message-ID: <n1326125452.82071@SSDGWY.mdc.com>
>Elbert G Rudasill wrote:
>(snip) detailed description of character development
>But *everyone's* right. No character development going on there.
>Certainly nothing as intense or brilliant as another one of Avon's
>"witty repastes". B-5 sucks and can't even compare to Blake's 7
Since this seems to be directed at me, I'll reply.
Actually, I NEVER said any of the above. I didn't say there was NO character
development. What I said was there are no characters on B5 that interest me,
regardless of how well developed they are.
I DID NOT say B5 sucks; I like the show. I just don't like it as much as B7. I
have never attacked B5 or the characters, but you seem to enjoy attacking Avon.
Yes, I like Avon. That's my choice.
I don't feel the need to attack B5 just because I prefer B7. I don't understand
where your hostility is coming from because nothing in my previous post was
derogatory to B5.
Can we end this now and get back to Blake's 7...
Courtney
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 17:12:40 EST
From: Bizarro7 <Bizarro7@aol.com>
To: sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu, blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] B5 & B7
Message-ID: <4f41694c.34cfad5a@aol.com>
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In a message dated 98-01-28 08:50:23 EST, sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu writes:
<< There's a list of references in Babylon 5, including B7 refs,
at http://www-theory.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~aaa/B5.Ref.html. It's arranged
by B5 episode and is up to the 4th season, I think.
Sue >>
Someone should notify the listkeepers that they missed a reference to B7 when
Psi Corp head Bester says something almost identical to: "We are not
expendible, we are not stupid, and we are not going." I can't remember the
exact episode name.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 16:01:00 -0800
From: "PATTI McCLELLAN" <patti.mcclellan@kyl.com>
To: egr@pobox.upenn.edu
Cc: "blakes7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re[2]: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
Message-ID: <Megw.4917510@powell.fabrik.com>
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I will remember your quick draw, and never approach you unarmed!
(This is me, giggling over here.)
Regarding Blake being manipulative, remember when Blake
challenged Avon's ability to handle the computers on the London, and
Avon first said something like, "Don't try and manipulate *me* Blake."
I think that was pretty blatant. But then, more subtly, and in a
tactic he used ever afterwards, Blake put Avon in a position where
his survival or his honor (which he would have denied having) demanded
that he cooperate with Blake. If I ever get time, I'll compile a
list, because I hear this question all the time.
Other species on the series: Decimas come to mind. The fact
that it costs less to costume a humanoid is the main culprit, I would
imagine.
Patti
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 00:30:48 -0000
From: "Tom Forsyth" <Tom.Forsyth@btinternet.com>
To: "B7 Lysator" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Cygnus Alpha 1/2
Message-Id: <E0xxif6-0000JE-00@snow.btinternet.com>
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Pat wrote:
> PATTI McCLELLAN wrote:
> >
> > Regarding Voices: I kept waiting for Avon to inquire of
> > Shevan whether he knew someone had attached a false eyeball
> > to his bandages.
> >
> LOL! :D I'll hafta remember that one for April Fool's Day.
>
> Actually, I assumed that was some sort of deliberately obvious
> prosthetic, rather like Hal Mellanby's big black eyeball thingy on his
> belt. Only Shevan was on a budget.
I thought it was G'kar's eye, myself.
Tom Forsyth.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 01:10:09 -0000
From: "Tom Forsyth" <Tom.Forsyth@btinternet.com>
To: "B7 Lysator" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Cygnus Alpha 2/2
Message-Id: <E0xxifJ-0000JE-00@snow.btinternet.com>
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Pat P boasted:
> Perhaps I've seen the other colored boards and mistook them for Chess
> sets? But then, my family was so poor we could only afford two colors.
> Pat P
Two! Luxury. My family had a lease on half a colour, and even then it were
puce. We 'ad to 'ave boards made out of half-puce and not-half-puce. It
were awful - couldn't tell council, or they'd 've declared not-half-puce a
colour, and we'd 've 'ad to pay 84% colour tax on it, and that would've
left us with not-8%-puce, which is 'owt good to nobody. Aye, life were
tough in those days.
Tom Forsyth.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 20:29:41 -0500 (EST)
From: NWOutsider <sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu>
To: "Blake's 7 list" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.3.95.980128202027.20015A-100000@alpha.bgsu.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, PATTI McCLELLAN wrote:
> Regarding Blake being manipulative, remember when Blake
[etc, respectfully snipped]
The problem I have, and perhaps other fen have as well, with the
whole "Blake is manipulative" thing is that Avon is so much more
manipulative on an ongoing, reptetitive, standard operating practice sort
of way, that even mentioning manipulation as a Blake trait is like
accusing one of the othrs of being a coward while Vila is around. Sure,
they might show occasional...umm...extreme caution 8-) but it's nothing
compared to Vila's mastery of the art. And the other problem is that
Avon's manipulativeness is NEVER mentioned except perhaps causally in
passing praise, even though it's blatant and doesn't have to be
extracted from the screen with mental forceps.
> Other species on the series: Decimas come to mind. The fact
> that it costs less to costume a humanoid is the main culprit, I would
> imagine.
Oh, yeah, the Decimas! I try so hard to forget about them 8-),
There's also Zil and the planet-size lifeform she infests, the
Trantinians ("Gambit"), the species that created the virus in "Killer," a
couple of species are mentioned when they're considering places for Gan in
"Breakdown," the Altas and Ultras, the Sand, the alien in Sarcophagus,
the alien race in "Time Squad," the aliens in "Duel"...do the moon disks
count?
Sue
sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu http://www.bgsu.edu/~sclerc/Blakes7.html
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 00:09:31 EST
From: ShilLance <ShilLance@aol.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] B5 & B7
Message-ID: <f23c90a4.34d00f0d@aol.com>
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In a message dated 98-01-28 16:11:45 EST, you write:
<< >
> Can you not see that some of your comments can be interpreted in the same
> light? I've always seen B5 as one big morning soap opera in space. B7 may
> have been many things, but soap opera it can never be called. besides, I
> don't think JMS has the guts to do an ending akin to the one we saw on B7
> anyway.
>
> Gwynn Shamlin
>
Perhaps, but the only thing I have to say about the end of B-5 is this.
Sooner or later, something goes "boom". 8-)
>>
And at the end of B7 lots of things go boom. Besides, with a new series, and
several telemovies planned, I doubt there will be any serious repercussions.
JMS knows he has to keep those characters alive for the sake of the franchise.
Gwynn
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 07:10:25 GMT
From: robbie@arakeen.demon.co.uk (Robbie)
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
Message-ID: <35112b58.1238152196@arakeen.demon.co.uk>
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On Tue, 27 Jan 1998 15:29:00 -0800, "PATTI McCLELLAN"
<patti.mcclellan@kyl.com> you did utter the following words of wisdom...
>delighted that he managed to pull it off. But B7 was my first love
>before B5 and it still is. Nevertheless, I understand those whose
>delight has not waned. How about a compromise -- we won't flame B5
>fans if they don't run B7 down to make B5 look better by comparison.
<delurks>
actually JMS is a really big fan of B7 - the sight of Joe's face at Wolf
last year was one of sheer wonderment when Gareth came up to present him
with the award - and seeing them deep in conversation for the rest of
the evening was fun.
I've liked both series, I grew up like most uk people, started on TOS/DW
and then when B7 started watched every episode - ok I was young when it
started but I recognised a good story when I saw it.
B5 has recently been the only quality SF I can get (I don't have sky,
etc)and I'm looking forward to season 5
robbie
--
"And let the stream of my love sweep into unfrequented channels!
How should a stream not finally find its way to the sea!" - Nietzsche
<*> robbie@arakeen.demon.co.uk <*> robert.irvine@gecm.com <*>
want the umtsb5 faq? mail faq@arakeen.demon.co.uk one will be returned
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 19:29:20 +0000 (GMT)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] B5 & B7
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.09-0128192920-0b0Rr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=ISO-8859-1
On Wed 28 Jan, Iain Coleman wrote:
>
> Both shows try to depict a universe of real people, where nice guys
> sometime finish last, and wearing a white hat is no guarantee of victory.
And for those (like me) who like both shows, there's always Redemption...
> Trying desperately to keep this on-topic... every so often people say
> "wouldn't it be a good idea if B7 were remade?". I don't think that would
> be a good idea. There's precious little good SF made these days, and I'd
> much prefer it to be original rather than rehashes of old shows. I mean,
> yeah, a big-budget B7 could be very good, but would it really be that much
> better than the original? I'd rather see new, intelligent adult SF. Of
> course, if it was written by Chris Boucher and starred Gareth Thomas I
> certainly wouldn't complain.
Must admit that I too would like to see the BBC make a good, new, original SF
show. If it was written by Chris Boucher and starred Gareth Thomas, I'd be
in heaven. I refuse to believe you could get a bad show out of that
particular combination.
We have to have new shows, no matter how much we love old ones. After all,
the shows we love were new once.
Judith
--
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7
Redemption 99 - The Blakes 7/Babylon 5 convention
26-28 February 1999, Ashford International Hotel, Kent
http://www.smof.com/redemption/
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 07:22:17 -0500
From: ay648@yfn.ysu.edu (Carol A. McCoy)
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: Re[2]: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
Message-ID: <199801291222.HAA26851@yfn.ysu.edu>
Sue wrote:
>On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, PATTI McCLELLAN wrote:
>
>> Other species on the series: Decimas come to mind. The fact
>> that it costs less to costume a humanoid is the main culprit, I would
>> imagine.
>
> Oh, yeah, the Decimas! I try so hard to forget about them 8-),
>There's also Zil and the planet-size lifeform she infests, the
>Trantinians ("Gambit"), the species that created the virus in "Killer," a
>couple of species are mentioned when they're considering places for Gan in
>"Breakdown," the Altas and Ultras, the Sand, the alien in Sarcophagus,
>the alien race in "Time Squad," the aliens in "Duel"...do the moon disks
>count?
Gill-breathing Wazis with an ability to remain dormant for several
days are mentioned in "Traitor."
Carol McCoy
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:46:50 -0700
From: "John J. Doherty" <alijd@gemini.oscs.montana.edu>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Cygnus Alpha Cult
Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980129084650.007e79e0@gemini.oscs.montana.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At 07:50 PM 1/28/98 GMT, Ken Minne wrote:
>>You can`t really compare Vargas` organisation with proper religion.
>>With Vargas, you followed him absolutely, or he had you killed. That`s
>>not true religion, that`s a dictatorship.
>>So I suppose it is natural for Gan to be confused.
>>
>>Bye for now
>>Jackie
>>
>
>I disagree with Jackie about comparing Vargas' organisation to a
>proper religion. It was prefectly comparable to the Holy Inquisition,
>the Taliban ( of Afganistan ) or any number of other loony cults.
>They may be barbaric, brutal, deluded and led by a megalomainiac liar,
>but none of that ever stops it from being a religion.
The Inquisition was not a religion, just an aberant wing within a religion.
I am not too sure what the Taliban is, I'll have to go look that up.
Vargas's religion is, indeed, much more comparable to a cult -- and perhaps
that was what Nation was trying to get at when he wrote the story. I have
always looked at the drug he feeds his people as a "mind control" analogy.
Perhaps, using the current terminolgy, we should refer to it as a New
Religious Movement, though the fact that it had been around a century of
two (I forget how long exactly) might belie that phrase. A bit like LDS
really -- considered a cult (or NRM) for a long time, it is now entering
the religious mainstream, in part beacuse it has been around for nearly 200
years.
-- John
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 11:17:14 EST
From: MLytle <MLytle@aol.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] sex/gender
Message-ID: <7d19e3ab.34d0ab8c@aol.com>
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Would someome please tell me, where is the B7 spin list? This is a topic I
would like to follow.
Thanks,
Maggie
------------------------------
Date: 28 Jan 1998 17:53:51 -0800
From: "Buck, Courtney" <buck#m#_courtney@ssdgwy.mdc.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] CHECKERS
Message-ID: <n1326059360.19793@SSDGWY.mdc.com>
>Sue Clerc wrote:
>but let me try to explain what it was that made me
>dislike the zine and think you had only contempt for Jenna.
>(snip) More than that, though, her punishments were more damaging and
>humiliating than what you put Avon through.
Well, Pat, *I* really liked CHECKERS. It's one of my fave PGP stories. The
Avon & Blake relationship was excellent. I especially liked their conversation
at the lake. That was beautifully written. ALL the dialogue between them was
well done.
The Avon/Servalan thing was wonderful. I love the way you wrote that
"experience" --
I liked the way you wrote Avon's relationship with the Scorpio crew once they'd
joined up with Blake...especially Soolin. ;)
It's been about a year since I've read it. I think I'll go read it again. I
don't remember thinking Jenna got worse than she gave. It seemed to me that she
got Avon pretty good a couple of times. I'll have to read it again keeping
Sue's remarks in mind.
>Sue Clerc wrote:
>As for Disgustingly Slavering Avon Fans...hey, I figure Avon's
>Simpering Sycophants has a better ring to it and a better acronym. 8-)
Sycophant? Sycophant? I hardly think that applies...however, if you're
determined to keep the acronym, how about Avon's Slavering Slaves?? That's a
badge I'll wear proudly.
Courtney
(an AVON fan)
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 13:58:31 +0000 (GMT)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] sex and SF
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.09-0129135831-bbaRr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=ISO-8859-1
Brief comment, because I'm half dead with asthma today.
Somebody, I forget who, said that people who enjoyed the homoerotic overtones
in the show were missing out on good SF.
Actually, it's quite possible to have both. I enjoyed the show as SF long
before I also enjoyed it as slash and I'm sure this holds for many others
too.
I can get just as much enjoyment from discussing whether Liberator utilises
hyperspace as I can from contemplating why Avon likes to wrap his arms around
Blake. It may be a different type of enjoyment, but it's just as real.
That's why I dislike the Sevenfold Crown so much - it's bad science fiction
(although the bit with the hyperspace near the start is quite ingenious).
The parts that I like tend to be the bits based around the character
relationships - that's where the actors defeated the writing and gave us
something worthwhile.
Judith
PS. This chain of thought was largely sparked off by reading the final story
in Straight Blakes #1 this morning. Although it's technically about Vila
having a fling with a lady smuggler (not Jenna), it is also excellent science
fiction. It's got interesting thoughts on spaceship design, practical use of
depressurisation alerts on an asteroid, gravity fluctuations caused by
maneuvering said asteriod with the artifical gravity cut out and lots of
other small details such as futuristic ways of loading dice, that are all
woven into the story. It's rare to see that degree of futuristic detail in a
gen story, let along an adult one, but I happen to enjoy it.
--
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7
Redemption 99 - The Blakes 7/Babylon 5 convention
26-28 February 1999, Ashford International Hotel, Kent
http://www.smof.com/redemption/
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 10:32:00 -0800
From: "PATTI McCLELLAN" <patti.mcclellan@kyl.com>
To: "Buck, Courtney" <buck#m#_courtney@ssdgwy.mdc.com>,
"blakes7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] CHECKERS
Message-ID: <Megw.4928716@powell.fabrik.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8Bit
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So, Courtney, are you a charter member of A.S.S. then? Is
membership also open to sentient computers with self-image
problems?
I love Avon myself, can I join?
Patti
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:46:09 -0000
From: Louise Rutter <Louise.Rutter@btinternet.com>
To: "'B7 Lysator'" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] Blake and manipulation
Message-ID: <01BD2CF0.00383A20@host5-99-61-161.btinternet.com>
Sue wrote:
> The problem I have, and perhaps other fen have as well, with the
>whole "Blake is manipulative" thing is that Avon is so much more
>manipulative on an ongoing, reptetitive, standard operating practice sort
>of way, that even mentioning manipulation as a Blake trait is like
>accusing one of the othrs of being a coward while Vila is around. Sure,
>they might show occasional...umm...extreme caution 8-) but it's nothing
>compared to Vila's mastery of the art. And the other problem is that
>Avon's manipulativeness is NEVER mentioned except perhaps causally in
>passing praise, even though it's blatant and doesn't have to be
>extracted from the screen with mental forceps.
And my problem with Blake is exactly that. Avon is blatant, what you see is
what you get - if anything he paints himself blacker than reality. Blake
claims to have the moral high ground, be the great idealist, while he is
just as deceitful and manipulative as Avon can be.
Louise
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:09:17 +0000
From: Julia Jones <Julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
Message-ID: <FeVx2BAtkD00Ew5+@jajones.demon.co.uk>
In message <Megw.4917510@powell.fabrik.com>, PATTI McCLELLAN
<patti.mcclellan@kyl.com> writes
> Other species on the series: Decimas come to mind. The fact
>that it costs less to costume a humanoid is the main culprit, I would
>imagine.
That and the fact that there is less to go wrong, I would imagine :-)
Those who recall the two Dr Who stories set on Peladon, and Alpha
Centauri the walking penis, will understand what I'm talking about.
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 09:55:45 +1300
From: Nicola Collie <nicola.collie@stonebow.otago.ac.nz>
To: B7-list <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] Other species
Message-Id: <l03102802b0f69c70d0af@[139.80.16.149]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
[Other people have mentioned Decimas, Zil + her planet, Trantians, the
species in "Killer", the one's mentioned in Breakdown, the Altas, the
Ultras, the Sand, the Sarcophagus alien, the Time Squad aliens, the Duel
aliens, the moon disks, the Wazis]
Also, the critters that jump Servalan and Travis in the tunnels in "Orac" -
are they called Phibians, or some such?
ttfn, Nicola
---
Nicola Collie nicola.collie@stonebow.otago.ac.nz
Dunedin, New Zealand
"It just occurred to me that, as the description of a highly sophisticated
technological achievement "Avon's gadget works," seems to lack a certain
style."
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 15:52:17 -0500 (EST)
From: Sondra Sweigman <sweigman@world.std.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Horizon Letterzine
Message-Id: <Pine.SGI.3.95.980129154852.27010B-100000@world.std.com>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
This query is for US list members who also subscribe to the
Horizon Letterzine: Have any of you received--or not received--your copy
of issue #21 yet? My understanding is that people in the UK have had
their copies for at least a week now, but neither I nor the one other US
subscriber I've been in touch with about it have ours, and we're trying to
find out if it's just us or if no one on this side of the pond has it yet.
Sondra
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 15:54:50 -0500 (EST)
From: NWOutsider <sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu>
To: "Blake's 7 list" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake and manipulation
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.3.95.980129154830.24403A-100000@alpha.bgsu.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, Louise Rutter wrote:
> And my problem with Blake is exactly that. Avon is blatant, what you see is
> what you get - if anything he paints himself blacker than reality. Blake
> claims to have the moral high ground, be the great idealist, while he is
> just as deceitful and manipulative as Avon can be.
Sorry, could you point out the scenes in the series where Blake
claims the moral high-ground for himself so we could discuss them? As
far as I can remember, he sort of generally mentions destroying the
Federation because it's corrupt, treats things as if they were more
important than people, and that sort of thing, but I don't remember
him actually calling himself a hero or being afraid to get his hands
and soul a little dirty in the process. I'm pretty sure he never
refers to himself as an idealist?
The thing with Avon, also, is that he makes a great stink
about Blake "handling" the others like it's a very naughty thing to
do and one simply ought not to to do it. And then turns around and
does worse himself.
Sue
sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu http://www.bgsu.edu/~sclerc/Blakes7.html
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:13:31 +0000
From: Julia Jones <Julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] B5 & B7
Message-ID: <I+EyuFAroD00Ew6+@jajones.demon.co.uk>
In message <f23c90a4.34d00f0d@aol.com>, ShilLance <ShilLance@aol.com>
writes
>In a message dated 98-01-28 16:11:45 EST, you write:
>
<snip>
>
> Perhaps, but the only thing I have to say about the end of B-5 is this.
>
> Sooner or later, something goes "boom". 8-)
> >>
>
>And at the end of B7 lots of things go boom. Besides, with a new series, and
>several telemovies planned, I doubt there will be any serious repercussions.
>JMS knows he has to keep those characters alive for the sake of the franchise.
On the other hand, lots of things went boom at the end of B7, but they
*were* hoping for a fifth series. Only one of the characters was
definitely dead, at the request of the actor, and even then the actor
concerned had forgotten about the clone - not that he's been allowed to
forget it since.
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:05:20 -0500 (EST)
From: NWOutsider <sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu>
To: "Blake's 7 list" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] CHECKERS
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.3.95.980129155543.24403B-100000@alpha.bgsu.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On 28 Jan 1998, Buck, Courtney wrote:
> Well, Pat, *I* really liked CHECKERS. It's one of my fave PGP stories. The
> Avon & Blake relationship was excellent. I especially liked their conversation
> at the lake. That was beautifully written. ALL the dialogue between them was
> well done.
I thought Blake was poorly portrayed, but I almost always think
that. 8-) Bryn Lantry, now, gives great Blake. Suzan Lovett, too. Very
few fan writers do him justice.
> >As for Disgustingly Slavering Avon Fans...hey, I figure Avon's
> >Simpering Sycophants has a better ring to it and a better acronym. 8-)
>
> Sycophant? Sycophant? I hardly think that applies...however, if you're
LOL. Well, of course you don't, sweetie. 8-)
> determined to keep the acronym, how about Avon's Slavering Slaves?? That's a
> badge I'll wear proudly.
I'm sure it is but I'll stick with the first where applicable.
Sue
sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu http://www.bgsu.edu/~sclerc/Blakes7.html
Come aboard. We're expecting you. CoD for Death Takes a Holiday cruises.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 14:49:42 -0700 (MST)
From: The Doctor <doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] I HAVE RETURNED
Message-Id: <199801292149.OAA18165@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Nice to be back.
Reason I was away so long: I buggered a I386 Unix system.
So:
Del Tarrant is the twit who had Blake nicked!!
--------------------------------
End of blakes7-d Digest V98 Issue #29
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