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blakes7-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 30
Today's Topics:
[B7L] Jenna
Re: [B7L] CHECKERS
Re: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
[B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Re: [B7L] Blake and manipulation
Re: [B7L] Jenna
Re: [B7L] sex/gender
Re: [B7L] Jenna
Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
[B7L] terminate
[B7L] remove
[B7L] Great Blake (was Checkers)
Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Re: [B7L] Blake and manipulation
Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Fwd: [B7L] Howdy..Another Houston TX Blake fan here
Re: [B7L] Texas B7 club information
Re: [B7L] Howdy..Another Houston TX Blake fan here
[B7L] Re: Cygnus Alpha Cult
Re[2]: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
[B7L] Double Standard
Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Re: [B7L] Howdy..Another Houston TX Blake fan here
[B7L] UK mag watch
FW: [B7L] Blake and manipulation
FW: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Re: [B7L] Ragnorok (was B5 & B7)
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:12:17 -0400
From: Girard Rudasill <egr@pobox.upenn.edu>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Jenna
Message-ID: <34D0F0A0.27C1@pobox.upenn.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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I'm watching "The Way Back" for the very first time, and all I can say
is:
Dude, Jenna's PHAT !!!!! (Pretty Hot And Tempting)
ArwooooOOOOOOO !!!!!!!!
A more critical analysis of the programme is forthcoming.
><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Girard Rudasill
Classroom Technology Services
Harnwell House, Suite 211
3820 Locust Walk
(215) 573-4004
egr@isc.upenn.edu
><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
"Then I will tell you a great secret, Captain. Perhaps the greatest of
all time.The molecules of your body are the same molecules that make
up this station and the nebula outside, that burn inside the stars
themselves. We are starstuff, we are the universe made manifest,
trying to figure itself out. And as we have both learned, sometimes the
universe requires a change of perspective."
- Ambassador Delenn, A Distant Star
Babylon-5
><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:34:55 EST
From: Bizarro7@aol.com
To: buck#m#_courtney@ssdgwy.mdc.com, blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] CHECKERS
Message-ID: <262f515b.34d10411@aol.com>
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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I have to admit I read this novel a couple of years ago and enjoyed it very
much--except for the portrayal of Jenna as a crazed, jealous, vindictive
maniac who deserved everything, cruel or humiliating, that happened to her.
This was my lasting impression.
Leah
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 20:18:03 +0000
From: Julia Jones <Julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blakes 7/Babylon 5
Message-ID: <uzgrtAA7PO00EwPi@jajones.demon.co.uk>
In message <Pine.OSF.3.95.980128202027.20015A-100000@alpha.bgsu.edu>,
NWOutsider <sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu> writes
>On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, PATTI McCLELLAN wrote:
>
>> Regarding Blake being manipulative, remember when Blake
>[etc, respectfully snipped]
>
> The problem I have, and perhaps other fen have as well, with the
>whole "Blake is manipulative" thing is that Avon is so much more
>manipulative on an ongoing, reptetitive, standard operating practice sort
>of way, that even mentioning manipulation as a Blake trait is like
>accusing one of the othrs of being a coward while Vila is around. Sure,
>they might show occasional...umm...extreme caution 8-) but it's nothing
>compared to Vila's mastery of the art. And the other problem is that
>Avon's manipulativeness is NEVER mentioned except perhaps causally in
>passing praise, even though it's blatant and doesn't have to be
>extracted from the screen with mental forceps.
>
I think this is precisely why people make a song and dance about Blake
being manipulative. Yes, Avon's manipulative, and blatant with it. He
doesn't pretend to be anything else. Blake's manipulative, but *he's*
supposed to be the hero, the guy in the white hat, so people say "Gee,
that guy 's manipulative".
If you really want to bitch about Avonphiles ignoring Avon's behaviour,
try asking why Avon so often carries on about Blake being manipulative,
then does precisely what Blake was trying to get him to do. Why didn't
he just do it in the first place?
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 15:45:00 -0800
From: "PATTI McCLELLAN" <patti.mcclellan@kyl.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Message-ID: <Megw.4934138@powell.fabrik.com>
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I may have given the impression that I think Blake is no
good and should have been shoved out an airlock. If so, I have
misspoken. I am, first and foremost, an Avon fan, it's true.
Nevertheless, for several reasons, not least of which is my
commitment to social justice, I see Blake as a good man, trying
to do what he not only feels is right, but what he *must* do, to
destroy the Federation. He watches it eating humanity alive in
great gulps, and cannot bear not to do something. While this is
his quest, it is also his tragedy. He is driven by it, much the
way Avon is driven by his own darkness. All great leaders
manipulate people. It's a gift, and in the good ones, it's
exercised half-unconsciously and never with malice or contempt.
This is one of the things Avon never understood about Blake, and
it nearly drove Avon mad. When Avon doesn't understand what
Blake's doing, or thinks he does and feels it endangers Avon's
safety (for what is Avon, but a nerd in pirate's clothing, bless
his black little heart), he lashes out at the man, made even more
afraid and furious (though he'd deny to his last breath that he
felt the fear) by Blake's general refusal to play the game by
fighting back, usually not even losing his cool.
Don't mean to start preaching, but it's my position that it
isn't necessary to vilify Blake if you like Avon. Nor is the
reverse necessary. If we do that, we start missing the subtle
signs of friendship that are sprinkled in the series. It's easy
not to see the evidence that Avon respected Blake's strength of
will, even if he ridiculed his belief that one man can make a
difference.
Patti
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 23:36:05 -0000
From: "Tom Forsyth" <Tom.Forsyth@btinternet.com>
To: "B7 Lysator" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake and manipulation
Message-Id: <E0xy3hL-0001CN-00@snow.btinternet.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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Sue wrote:
> The thing with Avon, also, is that he makes a great stink
> about Blake "handling" the others like it's a very naughty thing to
> do and one simply ought not to to do it. And then turns around and
> does worse himself.
I think he mostly makes a stink about Blake handling him. I don't think he
gives a stuff about the others. But he's quite prepared to use the others
in an argument with Blake, of course. Moral indignation is great if your
opponent believes in it and cares about it.
Tom Forsyth.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 23:51:19 -0000
From: "Tom Forsyth" <Tom.Forsyth@btinternet.com>
To: "B7 Lysator" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Jenna
Message-Id: <E0xy3qo-0005um-00@snow.btinternet.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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> I'm watching "The Way Back" for the very first time, and all I can say
> is:
>
> Dude, Jenna's PHAT !!!!! (Pretty Hot And Tempting)
>
> ArwooooOOOOOOO !!!!!!!!
>
> A more critical analysis of the programme is forthcoming.
[followed by 16 lines of sig]
Erm... this is a really excessive sig:message ratio, especially when you
remove the blank spaces in the message. Any chance of trimming it down a
bit? Ta.
Tom Forsyth.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 10:54:58 +1100
From: Ross Mallett <hawkeye@bluedog.apana.org.au>
To: blake7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] sex/gender
Message-Id: <v03110703b0f6c6f45ea9@[202.12.90.67]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At 11:17 AM -0500 29/1/98, MLytle wrote:
>Would someome please tell me, where is the B7 spin list? This is a topic I
>would like to follow.
>
>Thanks,
>Maggie
I would like to take this opportunity to plug the list.
This list was created as a place where off topic issues from the Blake's 7
list could be continued and explored in the depth.
Occasionally, a thread may drift back to Blake's 7 again and return to the
main list. All mail from the Off Topic List contains "b7spin:" in the
subject so you can tell.
See you there!
Ross
The techy details:
TO SUBSCRIBE: Send an e-mail with a subject of 'subscribe' to
'b7spin-request@metva.com.au'.
TO POST: Send an e-mail to
'b7spin@metva.com.au'
TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Send an e-mail with a subject line of 'unsubscribe' to
'b7spin-request@metva.com.au'.
TO CONTACT THE ADMINISTRATOR: Send an e-mail to
'hawkeye@bluedog.apana.org.au' or 'gail@instra.com.au'
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:50:37 +0000
From: Julia Jones <Julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Jenna
Message-ID: <+NhPyEA9eQ00EwOj@jajones.demon.co.uk>
In message <34D0F0A0.27C1@pobox.upenn.edu>, Girard Rudasill
<egr@pobox.upenn.edu> writes
>I'm watching "The Way Back" for the very first time, and all I can say
>is:
>
> Dude, Jenna's PHAT !!!!! (Pretty Hot And Tempting)
>
> ArwooooOOOOOOO !!!!!!!!
>
> A more critical analysis of the programme is forthcoming.
Well, Girard, are you enjoying yourself now that you're finally getting
to see the actual program rather than just read the scripts? :^)
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:58:19 -0600
From: "Lorna B." <msdelta@magnolia.net>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Message-Id: <199801300459.WAA21560@pemberton.magnolia.net>
Patti said:
> Don't mean to start preaching, but it's my position that it
>isn't necessary to vilify Blake if you like Avon. Nor is the
>reverse necessary. If we do that, we start missing the subtle
>signs of friendship that are sprinkled in the series. It's easy
>not to see the evidence that Avon respected Blake's strength of
>will, even if he ridiculed his belief that one man can make a
>difference.
Gee, you're good at this, Patti! Can we hire you as list diplomat? :-)
Might I add that it's also unnecessary to vilify *any* of the characters.
All of them made B7 what we know and love--they are part of the whole. No
one should feel a need to downgrade one character in order to play up
another. It's just not necessary--each one has his/her strengths, and
weaknesses, and I like each character all the better for them.
Lorna B.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 23:43:43 -0800
From: SKAFLOC@ix.netcom.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] terminate
Message-ID: <34D184AE.39E9@ix.netcom.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
terminate
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 23:43:22 -0800
From: SKAFLOC@ix.netcom.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] remove
Message-ID: <34D1849A.27A8@ix.netcom.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
remove
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 07:09:41 -0500
From: Harriet Monkhouse <H_F_Monkhouse@compuserve.com>
To: "Blake's 7 (Lysator)" <BLAKES7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] Great Blake (was Checkers)
Message-ID: <199801300710_MC2-313B-7C6A@compuserve.com>
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Sue said:
>Bryn Lantry, now, gives great Blake. Suzan Lovett, too.
Oh yes, oh yes, oh yes!
Not to mention great B/A & B-A.
Harriet
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 06:59:37 -0600
From: Lisa Williams <lcw@dallas.net>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980130065453.00e0be10@dallas.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Lorna B. wrote:
>Might I add that it's also unnecessary to vilify *any* of the
>characters.
Can we vilify the ones we really, really can't stand?
--
- Lisa
<lcw@dallas.net>
<lwilliams@mcopn1.dseg.ti.com>
Lisa's Frame Capture Library: http://lcw.simplenet.com/
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 13:34:17 -0000
From: "Jenni-Alison" <Jenni-Alison@dial.pipex.com>
To: "Blake's 7 list" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake and manipulation
Message-Id: <199801301341.OAA08337@samantha.lysator.liu.se>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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----------
> From: NWOutsider <sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu>
> To: Blake's 7 list <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
> Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake and manipulation
> Date: 29 January 1998 20:54
>
Sorry, could you point out the scenes in the series where Blake
> claims the moral high-ground for himself so we could discuss them?
As
> far as I can remember, he sort of generally mentions destroying the
> Federation because it's corrupt, treats things as if they were more
> important than people, and that sort of thing, but I don't remember
> him actually calling himself a hero or being afraid to get his
hands
> and soul a little dirty in the process. I'm pretty sure he never
> refers to himself as an idealist?
Avon says something like "another Idealist" when he hears about
Avalon, but I don't remember Blake ever saying it (he never disagrees
with Avon saying it, but what would be the point?). But what do we
mean by Idealist? Is it a bad thing? I always thought an idealist was
someone who believed that what they percieved as a perfect set of
circumstances (an Ideal) could be achieved if they tried hard enough.
Surely the only person who could see this as a bad thing is someone
who profits from the less than ideal circumstances i.e. the
Federation.
Jenni
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 08:46:17 -0500 (EST)
From: NWOutsider <sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu>
To: "Blake's 7 list" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.3.95.980130084112.27552M-100000@alpha.bgsu.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, Lorna B. wrote:
> Gee, you're good at this, Patti! Can we hire you as list diplomat? :-)
This isn't going to devolve into group hugs is it? 8-)
> Might I add that it's also unnecessary to vilify *any* of the characters.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, damn it, Lorna, it's fun! 8-) Where is the
bright line between discussing one's interpretation of character and
vilifying that character? Who gets to draw the line? What if one likes
the character as one sees him/her and thinks another poster has it all
wrong? What if what's being vilified isn't the character but a line
of interpretation?
> All of them made B7 what we know and love--they are part of the whole. No
> one should feel a need to downgrade one character in order to play up
> another.
I wish you'd posted this repeatedly over the last few months.
Sue
sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu http://www.bgsu.edu/~sclerc/Blakes7.html
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 08:40:40 -0500 (EST)
From: NWOutsider <sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu>
To: "Blake's 7 list" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.3.95.980130083154.27552K-100000@alpha.bgsu.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, PATTI McCLELLAN wrote:
> I may have given the impression that I think Blake is no
> good and should have been shoved out an airlock. If so, I have
> misspoken.
That's not how I read your post at all, Patti. I thought you
were giving an example that you thought answered the question. I
really meant "respectfully" when I said I'd "respectfully snipped" part of
your post.
> Don't mean to start preaching, but it's my position that it
> isn't necessary to vilify Blake if you like Avon. Nor is the
> reverse necessary.
8-) I didn't see vilification of the characters in any of the
posts. Personally, I wasn't vilifying any of the characters, I was
vilifying a double standard I've encountered in a lot of fan fic.
Sue
sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu http://www.bgsu.edu/~sclerc/Blakes7.html
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 11:19:24 EST
From: DCsquared@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Fwd: [B7L] Howdy..Another Houston TX Blake fan here
Message-ID: <69214d73.34d1fd8f@aol.com>
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In a message dated 98-01-25 00:21:09 EST, Thomas writes:
<< ...Everything
is bigger (and better) in Texas (hahaha...!!)
>>
Except my local PBS station, who have quit showing both B7 and Dr. Who AND Red
Dwarf! They dropped Dr. Who right after running a big fund raiser which
spottlighted Dr. Who and urged all Who fans to send in their money so they
could continue running the series. The support from Who fans was tremendous.
Two weeks later, they dropped Who, but kept the money. Made me REALLY mad!!
Donna
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From: DCsquared@aol.com
Return-path: <DCsquared@aol.com>
To: the_liberator@usa.pipeline.com
Subject: Re: [B7L] Howdy..Another Houston TX Blake fan here
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 11:17:42 EST
Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com)
Mime-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 98-01-25 00:21:09 EST, Thomas writes:
<< ...Everything
is bigger (and better) in Texas (hahaha...!!)
>>
Except my local PBS station, who have quit showing both B7 and Dr. Who AND Red
Dwarf! They dropped Dr. Who right after running a big fund raiser which
spottlighted Dr. Who and urged all Who fans to send in their money so they
could continue running the series. The support from Who fans was tremendous.
Two weeks later, they dropped Who, but kept the money. Made me REALLY mad!!
Donna
--part0_886177165_boundary--
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 11:25:46 EST
From: DCsquared@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Texas B7 club information
Message-ID: <ae230bf8.34d1ff10@aol.com>
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In fact, I am an ORAC member. But Dallas is a good five hours from Houston,
which makes joining the gatherings rather difficult. But they do have an
excellent newletter :-)
Donna
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 11:39:02 EST
From: DCsquared@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Howdy..Another Houston TX Blake fan here
Message-ID: <1624a3fb.34d20228@aol.com>
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
In a message dated 98-01-29 17:46:53 EST, you write:
<<
Hi!
Although I now live in California, I am originally from Baytown. :)
I also have a friend who lives B7 and who lives in the Clear Lake area.
Seems like there are more than either of you know about.
Tramila
Avon's a babe but Vila is devine. heh heh
>>
I live in Clear Lake also!! (suburb of Houston). Is your friend on the list?
If not, get her started. I think this makes 5 of us from Houston. Just about
enough for a party, eh!
Donna
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 12:20:37 EST
From: penny_kjelgaard@juno.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Re: Cygnus Alpha Cult
Message-ID: <19980130.091758.2711.0.Penny_Kjelgaard@juno.com>
John wrote:
****
Perhaps, using the current terminolgy, we should refer to it as a New
Religious Movement, though the fact that it had been around a century of
two (I forget how long exactly) might belie that phrase. A bit like LDS
really -- considered a cult (or NRM) for a long time, it is now entering
the religious mainstream, in part beacuse it has been around for nearly
200
years.
******
We are 158 years old this April, John. Some still call us a cult, which
befuddles me since people join and leave the church all the time. Nice
to know there are enlightened individuals, such as yourself, who know
otherwise.
Then again, you are a B7 fan, so, how much more enlightened can you get?
<G>
Penny
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 09:44:00 -0800
From: "PATTI McCLELLAN" <patti.mcclellan@kyl.com>
To: "Lorna B." <msdelta@magnolia.net>, "blakes7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re[2]: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Message-ID: <Megw.4943387@powell.fabrik.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8Bit
Content-Disposition: inline
List diplomat? What's it pay? I AM an Avon fan, after all.
Patti
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 09:59:00 -0800
From: "PATTI McCLELLAN" <patti.mcclellan@kyl.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Double Standard
Message-ID: <Megw.4943866@powell.fabrik.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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I know what Sue means about a double standard. When I first
found fandom, I probably did that too, mentally even if not in
stories I wrote. Well, probably in the stories too. But over
the years, I've written so many stories from so many points of
view, it's hard for me to completely blacken anyone in whose
shoes I've walked. Yes, even Tarrant. And the fact that the
Godmother of the Tarrant Nostra is a friend of mine has nothing
to do with it. Honest!
Patti
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 12:18:51 -0600
From: "Lorna B." <msdelta@magnolia.net>
To: "Blake's 7 list" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Message-Id: <199801301820.MAA12818@pemberton.magnolia.net>
> Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, damn it, Lorna, it's fun! 8-) Where is the
>bright line between discussing one's interpretation of character and
>vilifying that character? Who gets to draw the line? What if one likes
>the character as one sees him/her and thinks another poster has it all
>wrong? What if what's being vilified isn't the character but a line
>of interpretation?
I've noticed the folks who most vilify other characters are often the first
to go ballistic when the tables are turned. I find it all silly, myself,
since I like all the characters (with Vila as fave)--it wouldn't be B7
without 'em. Vilification (perhaps that would have been a better name for
Homeworld?) tells me a lot more about the fans than it does about the
characters they're discussing, and I'd rather discuss the characters.
>> All of them made B7 what we know and love--they are part of the whole.
>>No one should feel a need to downgrade one character in order to play >>up
another.
>
> I wish you'd posted this repeatedly over the last few months.
I suppose I could set up an automatic post of some kind. :-) Better yet,
we'll just set it to continually email that %$&# owl spammer!
Lorna B.
"You ever flown a flying saucer? After that, sex seems trite."
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 12:25:55 -0600
From: "Lorna B." <msdelta@magnolia.net>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Howdy..Another Houston TX Blake fan here
Message-Id: <199801301827.MAA13083@pemberton.magnolia.net>
>Except my local PBS station, who have quit showing both B7 and Dr. Who >AND
Red Dwarf!
Well, in a way you can count yourself lucky, because none of those has ever
run (to my knowledge) in this state. And probably never will, either. No,
we mostly get endless repeats of Allo, Allo and Are You Being Served.
(Do you think there might be little hotbeds of fandom for those two shows?
Fanfic and all? Stranger things have happened.)
Lorna B.
"You ever flown a flying saucer? After that, sex seems trite."
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 19:23:51 +0100 GMT
From: STEVE.ROGERSON@MCR1.poptel.org.uk
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
CC: space-city@world.std.com
Subject: [B7L] UK mag watch
Message-Id: <198458204MCR1@MCR1.poptel.org.uk>
Re Blakes 7 interviews in mags, I was asked: "Any chance that
you could provide issue numbers for Area 51, Cult TV, Cult
Times, and SFX? (I already know Dreamwatch 41 and
Starburst 233.)"
Area 51 issue 2
Cult TV season2, episode 1 (I know it's silly but that's how it
numbers itself)
Cult Times winter special
SFX No 34
cheers
Steve Rogerson
Redemption 99 - The Blakes 7/Babylon 5 convention
26-28 February 1999, Ashford International Hotel, Kent
http://www.smof.com/redemption/
Make your own tribble! Buy a hamster and cut off its legs
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 20:19:06 -0000
From: Louise Rutter <Louise.Rutter@btinternet.com>
To: "'B7 Lysator'" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: FW: [B7L] Blake and manipulation
Message-ID: <01BD2DBF.EA076AC0@host5-99-54-129.btinternet.com>
On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, Louise Rutter wrote:
> >And my problem with Blake is exactly that. Avon is blatant, what you see
is
>> what you get - if anything he paints himself blacker than reality. Blake
>> claims to have the moral high ground, be the great idealist, while he is
>> just as deceitful and manipulative as Avon can be.
And Sue replied:
> Sorry, could you point out the scenes in the series where Blake
>claims the moral high-ground for himself so we could discuss them? As
>far as I can remember, he sort of generally mentions destroying the
>Federation because it's corrupt, treats things as if they were more
>important than people, and that sort of thing, but I don't remember
>him actually calling himself a hero or being afraid to get his hands
>and soul a little dirty in the process. I'm pretty sure he never
>refers to himself as an idealist?
No, because there are no times when Blake claims to be of superior morality
or an idealist _in specific words_.
I didn't mean he claims it literally, as I'm sure you could guess. But if
you want a specific example, how about the exchange between Blake and Avon
in the London computer room, when Blake is so scathing about Avon's plans
to look after himself? When Blake gives his speech about how he isn't free
until all men can think and speak freely?
I'm fairly sure that Blake is feeling very morally superior right then, and
probably justifiably. But for someone who holds such high morals, Blake can
conveniently forget them when it suits him.
Louise
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 20:35:20 -0000
From: Louise Rutter <Louise.Rutter@btinternet.com>
To: "'B7 Lysator'" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: FW: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Message-ID: <01BD2DBF.EE9CD160@host5-99-54-129.btinternet.com>
Patti said:
> Don't mean to start preaching, but it's my position that it
>isn't necessary to vilify Blake if you like Avon. Nor is the
>reverse necessary. If we do that, we start missing the subtle
>signs of friendship that are sprinkled in the series. It's easy
>not to see the evidence that Avon respected Blake's strength of
>will, even if he ridiculed his belief that one man can make a
>difference.
And I couldn't agree more. Atm I happen to be criticising Blake, because
Sue asked why some people object to Blake's manipulations more than Avon's.
So I told her. On previous occasions on this list and elsewhere I've voiced
what I considered to be valid criticisms of Avon. I've personally been a
bigger fan of Avon since the age of 6, when I thought his sarcasm was fun
and "cool", but that doesn't stop me seeing the good points and flaws in
all the crew.
Louise
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 21:09:19 +1100
From: Kathryn Andersen <kat@welkin.apana.org.au>
To: "Blake's 7 list" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake and Manipulation
Message-ID: <19980130210919.02700@welkin.apana.org.au>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On Thu, Jan 29, 1998 at 10:58:19PM -0600, Lorna B. wrote:
> Might I add that it's also unnecessary to vilify *any* of the characters.
> All of them made B7 what we know and love--they are part of the whole. No
> one should feel a need to downgrade one character in order to play up
> another. It's just not necessary--each one has his/her strengths, and
> weaknesses, and I like each character all the better for them.
Here here! Ditto, likewise, enthusiastic agreement.
Diabolic logic decrees
The path to elevation
lies in dragging others down.
It lies.
Virtue shines with its own light.
Casting mud
does not increase your candlepower.
It merely feeds the darkness.
...
That isn't to say that people can't dislike certain characters or point
out their flaws. But to attack Blake (or Jenna or whoever) and then say
that that makes Avon (or Blake or whoever) look better - that's silly.
Illogical. Avon's weaknesses would be the same even if Blake had never
existed - so how is attacking Blake going to make Avon's weaknesses less
weak? Of course, this is not to say that we can't debate as to which one
is stronger in one area or another, but to feel obliged to defend Avon's
weaknesses by having a tirade against Blake (or visa versa) - that's just
stupid.
--
_--_|\ | Kathryn Andersen <kat@welkin.apana.org.au>
/ \ | http://connexus.apana.org.au/~kat
\_.--.*/ | #include "std/disclaimer.h"
v |
------------| Melbourne -> Victoria -> Australia -> Southern Hemisphere
Maranatha! | -> Earth -> Sol -> Milky Way Galaxy -> Universe
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 21:26:57 EST
From: EvanLooy@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Ragnorok (was B5 & B7)
Message-ID: <181f3071.34d28bf3@aol.com>
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Reuben wrote:
> I am curious. Is Ragnorok just a Dr. Who reference (The Greatest Show
> in the Galaxy) or is it an actual mythical place?
It's an event in Norse mythology, the end of the world, when all the monsters
and the enemies of the gods will rise up and attack Valhalla. The gods and all
the warriors who have died bravely and who have spent the eons drinking and
eating in Valhalla will rush out and fight the last fight, in which all will
die and the world will be destroyed.
Remind you of a certain Blake's 7 episode, perhaps?
Not too literally, perhaps, the final annihilation theme is certainly there,
I'd say.
Ragnarok is set in motion by Loki, who is one of the gods but rather an
unreliable one. He is a prankster and a rather charismatic troublemaker, but
generally of good will until his last deed, of course. I'm not sure whom we
could cast as B7's Loki.
Elise
--------------------------------
End of blakes7-d Digest V98 Issue #30
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