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blakes7-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 318
Today's Topics:
Re: [B7L] RPG
[B7L] worst cast
Re: [B7L] worst cast
Re: [B7L] T.'s Offer to S. in 'The Keeper'
Re: [B7L] RPG
Re: [B7L] RPG
Re: [B7L] RPG
Re: [B7L] RPG
Re: [B7L] RPG
Re: [B7L] RPG
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1998 02:12:53 -0000
From: "Neil Faulkner" <N.Faulkner@tesco.net>
To: "lysator" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] RPG
Message-ID: <003001be3075$ecb45260$7918ac3e@default>
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>Since these characters are already 'established'--meaning, they're not just
>starting out--they would have higher total points than a new player
>character.
Part of the GURPS premise is that new characters can be hardened veterans,
but they still start off with the basic 100 points.
This thread's in grave danger of turning into a theoretical accounting
exercise, with people not seeing the point for the points (I would say it
was getting pointless, but...). I think, perhaps, it might be better to
forget about point totals altogether, and just allocate stats, skills, ads,
disads etc that feel right. Fit the rules to the character, as it were,
rather than try to squeeze the character into the rules.
But that still wouldn't solve all the arguments over the actual values of
such stats. Most players designing their favourite characters in such a
free form way would probably inflate the more vital values, even if they
thought they were being scrupulously fair (I wouldn't trust myself to design
Cally, for instance, and I'm not sure I could go along entirely with anyone
else's version).
A basic rule of thumb I've devised over the years: players are more likely
to be truly roleplaying if they don't always take decisions in their
character's best interests. Like spending half the loot on a really cool
pair of mirror shades rather than getting yet another megakill handblaster.
Or beefing up some obscure academic skill that will almost certainly never
be of any use in play.
Thinking about it, my B7 character of choice would probably be Dayna. A
precocious whining brat who likes heavy weapons, a perfect vehicle for
wanton mayhem and carnage. And if everything goes pear-shaped you can just
pout and go sulk in a corner. What a gal!
Neil
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1998 20:58:01 GMT
From: Roger the Shrubber <powerplay@cheerful.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] worst cast
Message-Id: <199812262058.UAA10360@axis>
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BLAKES 7 THE MOVIE
"THE UNDISCOVERED INSURRECTION AT FARPOINT"
Starring:
Roj Blake.........................Jonathon Harris
Kerr Avon.........................William Shatner
Jenna Stannis.....................Pamela Anderson Lee or Christine Applegate
Cally.............................Marilyn Manson
Villa Restal......................Paul Reubins(pee wee herman)
Olag Gan..........................Dan Ackroyd
Servalan..........................Boy George
ORAC..............................Judge Judy
Zen ..............................voice of Majel Barret
Tarrant...........................Leonardo Di Caprio
Travis(I).........................Ice-T or Bruce Willis
Travis(II)........................Jonathon Harris (again)
Special guests -
The Two Fat Ladies as the Decimas
Basil Fawlty as the manager of Freedom City
Andie McDowell as Cancer
George Michael as Egrorian
Michael Jackson as Zil
Kevin Trudeau as Trooper Par
Crew:
Directed by.......................That English prat from the Cyclone exercise
machine informercial
Written by........................Paul Darrow
Music by..........................Muriels Wedding soundtrack
___________________________________
from Darren r ..... Comments are welcome !
powerplay@cheerful.com
____________________________________
Culture is a synthesis of reason and religion, attempting to hide
the sharp distinction between the two poles.
______________________________________
Traditions had a beginning that was not traditional.
________________________________________
________________________________________
http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/2634
Anxiety & Panic
_________________________________________
http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/2634/powerplay.html
Blake's 7 FAQ & free screen savers
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1998 02:48:44 PST
From: "Penny Dreadful" <pdreadful@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] worst cast
Message-ID: <19981226104844.25044.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain
Roger the Shrubber horrified me with the prospect of:
>Written by........................Paul Darrow
And speaking of celebrities who should be prevented in future from
writing, at gunpoint if necessary, I just got Drew Carey's Cash-Grab
Celebrity Autobiography (Now Appearing in a Sub-Discount Bin Near You)
for Xmas, and the first, like, ten pages are Drew Carey swearing the
thing was not ghost-written, which harked back to how many many moons
ago I received "Avon: A Terrible Aspect" for Xmas, and after reading it,
in desperate search of praise, latching upon "He obviously wrote it
himself."
Which makes me wonder now I think about it whether there is a market for
ghost-writers who can convincingly simulate inept amateur prose, for
that sense of verite...
(I should add here that I really did enjoy the latter book, and spent
all Xmas afternoon irking my relatives by reading excerpts out loud from
the former. And using my chilling powers of prescience I predict I will
finish reading it long before I finish "Mason & Dixon", which I got
*last* Xmas)
In conclusion,
Blake - Drew Carey
Avon - Don McKellar
Servalan - Woody Harrelson
Travis - Juliette Lewis
And A Merry Boxing Day To You and Yours,
Penny Dreadful
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1998 03:15:52 PST
From: "Penny Dreadful" <pdreadful@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] T.'s Offer to S. in 'The Keeper'
Message-Id: <199812261115.DAA01634@f282.hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain
Pat pined:
>Hey, this story has everything for a tragic love story. Who wants to
>write it? Please post it to the list in time for a "broken hearts"
>Valentines Day gazette here.
What, you mean here, or on the Naughty List?
>Altho Servalan/Jarvik has undeveloped potential!
Yeah, the interaction between those two was what made it *plausible* to
me, after the fact, that Servalan and Travis could reasonably be
considered to have had Something Going On.
-- Polymorphously Perverse Penny Dreadful
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1998 23:33:53 GMT
From: dixonm@access.mountain.net (Meredith Dixon)
To: "Neil Faulkner" <N.Faulkner@tesco.net>
Cc: "lysator" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] RPG
Message-ID: <36867023.1279603@cyberplanet.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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>How do people go about rolegaming B7? Do you use the series characters, or
>originals?
My husband and I have done a little bit of B7 RPGing, but we've found
it very difficult to do because the Seven are very vulnerable. The GM
creating the missions has to remain aware of the group's limitations
at all times. This is especially true for us because my husband is a
strict "rules" gameplayer; he'd never think of fudging a roll in the
interests of the story line, and he'd be offended if I did so. The
first B7 mission I ran, I think the only people who survived were
Vila and Cally, and while that may do for an ending it makes a lousy
start to a campaign. (We started over with a revised mission....)
We experimented with using the *Price of Freedom* rules for B7, but
in the end, as we usually do, we went back to using Marvel Super
Heroes' rules. They worked fairly well, all things considered.
It never occurred to us to attempt a B7 RPG without the series
characters, or even with the series characters as NPCs.
Meredith Dixon
dixonm@access.mountain.net
------------------------------
Date: 27 Dec 1998 01:51:42 +0100
From: calle@lysator.liu.se
To: "lysator" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] RPG
Message-ID: <m3ogoqxv8h.fsf@lysator.liu.se>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
dixonm@access.mountain.net (Meredith Dixon) writes:
> This is especially true for us because my husband is a strict
> "rules" gameplayer; he'd never think of fudging a roll in the
> interests of the story line, and he'd be offended if I did so.
Weee, my very opposite. One of my players once calculated that on the
average, I use dice in almost every third gaming session :-)
If you'd like to see what sort of system I use when GMing, have a look
at http://www.lysator.liu.se/~calle/gm/goodnesspoints.html And I'd
like to point out that not using dice does *not* mean that the
characters always succeed. It only means that they fail in
dramatically appropriate ways.
I have lots of GURPS books (50+ of them), but only use them for
background and inspiration.
> The first B7 mission I ran, I think the only people who survived
> were Vila and Cally, and while that may do for an ending it makes a
> lousy start to a campaign.
It makes for a great prequel, though. You tell the players to choose
characters from the series crew, then you run a really, really bad
blood'n'guts session killing off all but one or two of them. For the
next session, they get to play the new recruits. A small group of
rebels, led by a *seriously* bitter and nasty (NPC) Cally (or whoever
is left over from session one). For added spice, put her in a
wheelchair, give her a couple of bad burn-scars and boost her psychic
powers so that the PCs can't keep anything secret from her. Sort of
like Santa Claus on a bad angst-trip. "She knows if you've been good
or bad..."
> It never occurred to us to attempt a B7 RPG without the series
> characters, or even with the series characters as NPCs.
The only way I can see it working at all is with the series characters
as NPCs. NPCs important for the story, but still NPCs. Having the
players be a presidentially appointed team out to get Blake&co behind
Servalan's back might be fun.
--
Calle Dybedahl, Vasav. 82, S-175 32 Jaerfaella,SWEDEN | calle@lysator.liu.se
Try again. Try harder. -*- Fail again. Fail better.
------------------------------
Date: 27 Dec 1998 03:00:46 +0100
From: calle@lysator.liu.se
To: "lysator" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] RPG
Message-ID: <m3k8zexs1d.fsf@lysator.liu.se>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
"Neil Faulkner" <N.Faulkner@tesco.net> writes:
> Part of the GURPS premise is that new characters can be hardened veterans,
> but they still start off with the basic 100 points.
No. New characters start with as many points as the GM wants them to
start with. 100 points with a 40-point disadvantage limit is the
suggested values for "hero-material" characters. If the PCs are
supposed to be something else, they'll have other point values. Most
worldbooks suggest several different values for differently flavoured
campaigns. For example, GURPS Camelot suggests that starting Knights
of the Round Table be built with 200 points or so, and GURPS Martial
Arts suggests 300 or 400 points for a "Kung Fu Movie" campaign (and 25
to 50 for a "total beginners" campaign).
In a B7 context, all the series characters are clearly not equal in
point value, since the point value is a combined measure of talent and
experience. Even though Dayna is a very talented weapons designer,
Avon's going to have more points since he's not only talented but also
educated and experienced. At a rough guess, I'd put Dayna and Gan at
100 points, Tarrant, Vila and Soolin at 150 and the rest at 200, if
they were PCs. If they were NPCs, I'd forget about limits and just
design them as I wanted them.
> I think, perhaps, it might be better to forget about point totals
> altogether, and just allocate stats, skills, ads, disads etc that
> feel right. Fit the rules to the character, as it were, rather than
> try to squeeze the character into the rules.
That's how you're *always* supposed to use the rules! The rules are
there to *help* the game, not hinder it.
> Most players designing their favourite characters in such a free
> form way would probably inflate the more vital values,
In my experience, reasonably mature players generally don't. If they
want to play Cally, they want to play Cally, not a superheroine with
her face. In over 16 years of GMing, I've only had the supercharacter
problem with teenage boys. Actually, the opposite problem (giving
characters so many disadvantages that they become totally
dysfunctional) is in my experience much more common.
> Or beefing up some obscure academic skill that will almost certainly never
> be of any use in play.
I once had a player who put more than half of his character's points
into "Aristotelian physics". In a modern-day campaign...
> Thinking about it, my B7 character of choice would probably be Dayna. A
> precocious whining brat who likes heavy weapons, a perfect vehicle for
> wanton mayhem and carnage. And if everything goes pear-shaped you can just
> pout and go sulk in a corner. What a gal!
I once got to play Servalan in a Travaller game. She was the
commanding officer for an expedition to some frontier planet. It was
enormously entertaining. Several times I managed to get other players
so filled with impotent hatred that they couldn't even talk :-)
--
Calle Dybedahl, Vasav. 82, S-175 32 Jaerfaella,SWEDEN | calle@lysator.liu.se
Try again. Try harder. -*- Fail again. Fail better.
------------------------------
Date: 27 Dec 1998 02:34:29 +0100
From: calle@lysator.liu.se
To: "lysator" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] RPG
Message-ID: <m3lnjuxt96.fsf@lysator.liu.se>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
"Neil Faulkner" <N.Faulkner@tesco.net> writes:
> Jenna estimated the contents of the Liberator's strongroom at 300
> million credits, which between the six of the crew makes 50 million
> each. This is 10,000 times average starting wealth and would have a
> character point cost of several thousand...
No, it'd cost 100 points ("Multimillionaire" advantage, introduced in
GURPS Imperial Rome to model people like Crassus). And personally I
wouldn't charge nearly that much for it, since they can't really use
it, being outside of ordinary society as they are. It's more like
Comfortable Wealth (they don't have to care about cash when they go
down to a planet).
> Blake at least would certainly have a high Reputation.
That he would. Note that it'd be a double-edged reputation, though.
He'll be recognised, but he can't know if he'll be thought of as a
bloodthirsty terrorist or as a valiant freedom-fighter. The GM would
have to balance this according to hir view of the B7 universe.
> (what does GURPS Cyberpunk say about characters who start with
> implants?).
"Pay points for it".
> More to the point, how do you stop it cracking open top secret files
> and ripping the GM's plot to shreds?
Through its wonderfully pleasant and helpful personality, most
probably. If played correctly, they should be ready to toss him out
the airlock after the first session.
Unless it's a very, *very* strange campaign, Orac absolutely should
not be a player character.
> which doesn't leave much to spend on stats and skills.
Huh? Why would starting-character limits apply to people like
Servalan? The Servie we see in the series very clearly is not a fresh
beginner.
You could center a campaign around her rise to power, I guess, but
then she wouldn't have most of her advantages at the start.
> All in all, I think GURPS is a very silly game - it leaves far too
> much open to interpretation (and hence argument).
Also known as "flexible enough to fit the GM's vision". It's just
about the only game I know of that manages to have a rigid structure
without turning into a straightjacket. But I guess that's mainly a
matter of taste.
--
Calle Dybedahl, Vasav. 82, S-175 32 Jaerfaella,SWEDEN | calle@lysator.liu.se
Try again. Try harder. -*- Fail again. Fail better.
------------------------------
Date: 27 Dec 1998 02:17:21 +0100
From: calle@lysator.liu.se
To: "B7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] RPG
Message-ID: <m3n24axu1q.fsf@lysator.liu.se>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
"Taina Nieminen" <taina@netspace.net.au> writes:
> A doctor, say, who has electronics operation (medical equipment) is
> able to, by default, repair, say, radars or computers.
No, she isn't. According to the rules book, she's able to do simple
repairs _on equipment she's familiar with_ (so, ok, she *can* change a
fuse in the radar on her yacht). GURPS is far from perfect, but we can
at least pick on the faults it actually _has_.
> Most of my GMing in the last five years has been using a skill-based
> system I created myself, but it's in limbo at the moment between revisions
<opinion>
Before designing a system, the designer-to-be should at least have
played one level-based system (AD&D, RoleMaster), one skill-based
system (RuneQuest, Call of Cthulhu), one advantage-based system
(GURPS, Ars Magica), one very simple system (TWERPS), one extremely
detailed system (Timelords (no, it doesn't have anything to do with Dr
Who)), one very serious game (Pendragon), one very silly game
(Paranoia, Toon) and a just plain odd one (Over the Edge, Amber).
</opinion>
And this isn't any sort of criticism of you, Tania, I'm just ranting
at the world in general.
> The Champions game I'm running (which I've started only recently)
> faces a similar problem in that it uses established characters from
> a comicbook series (Legion of Superheroes).
Phage Press' Amber game has this problem built right into it. The
entire game is built on Roger Zelazny's series of books[1] and
characters from the books are very important. How it works out in
practice is that what you see in the game is different interpretations
of the original characters. One GM's Benedict will be a lot different
from another GM's Benedict (or, indeed, from the same Gm's Benedict in
another campaign), but that's no problem since what we see of Benedict
in Zelazny's books isn't anything close to his whole story. Different
GMs give different views, and I think it would work the same with the
B7 universe. After all, a whole lot of that sort of reinterpretation
is already going on in fanfiction.
[1] "Nine Princes in Amber", "The Guns of Avalon", "Sign of the
Unicorn", "The Hand of Oberon" and "The Courts of Chaos".
--
Calle Dybedahl, Vasav. 82, S-175 32 Jaerfaella,SWEDEN | calle@lysator.liu.se
Try again. Try harder. -*- Fail again. Fail better.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1998 22:09:29 EST
From: AChevron@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] RPG
Message-ID: <aeea7b34.3685a4e9@aol.com>
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 98-12-26 21:06:26 EST, you write:
<< One of my players once calculated that on the
average, I use dice in almost every third gaming session :-) >>
Well, I use dice about every 2 actions that the PCs take, but only about 1
in 10 rolls actually count for anything. D. Rose
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End of blakes7-d Digest V98 Issue #318
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