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blakes7-d Digest Volume 99 : Issue 216
Today's Topics:
Re: Tarrant and Vila (was Re: [B7L] Servalan)(long)
Re: [B7L] Costume query
[B7L] Lyst wars
Re: [B7L] Re: Re: Soolin (was Servalan)
Re: Tarrant and Vila (was Re: [B7L] Servalan)(long)
Re: [B7L] Servalan
Re: [B7L] Lyst wars
Re: Tarrant and Vila (was Re: [B7L] Servalan)(long)
Re: [B7L] Costume query
Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Cally's humour (was Re: [B7L] Re: Soolin (was Servalan))
Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
[B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Re: Tarrant and Vila (was Re: [B7L] Servalan)(long)
RE: [B7L] You know you've watched too much B7 when...
RE: [B7L] Another door closes
RE: [B7L] Ultraworld Question
RE: [B7L] Query
Re: [B7L] You know you've watched too much B7 when...
Re: [B7L] Query
[B7L] Re: Warm and fuzzy (was Soolin)
Re: [B7L] Costume query
Re: [B7L] Costume query
[B7L] B7 newsgroup
Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 20:05:15 EDT
From: Mac4781@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: Tarrant and Vila (was Re: [B7L] Servalan)(long)
Message-ID: <1a81d6c4.24ba8b3b@aol.com>
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So much delectable Vila-Tarrant discussion.... :) How can I resist
participating?
Lorna (sometimes quoting TigerM) wrote:
> IMO, I think he pretty much knew Tarrant wasn't the type to just leave him
> out there. He may not have been over the moon in love with Tarrant, but I
> think he had picked up on the fact that Tarrant was pretty loyal to his
> crewmates by this time.
What do you mean "not over the moon in love with Tarrant"? I happen to know
that they were shagging in the aft cargo bay every chance they got. ;)
> >On the two occasions
> >when Tarrant bullied Vila, the situation was critical. In "City at the
> Edge
> >of the World," they had to have those crystals if they wanted to have a
> >functioning weaponry system. Norl had specifically asked for Vila, and
> >Tarrant believed Vila could handle anything that happened down on Keezarn.
> >Tarrant didn't know they were dealing with Bayban.
>
> Yes. Would have been a much shorter series without those crystals.
It should also be noted that Kool Hand Norl completely bamboozled Bayban into
thinking he was peaceful and cooperative. Tarrant wasn't the only one fooled
by Norl's act.
> And I have to wonder why Avon and Cally didn't ask for details on this plan
> before Vila went down to Keezarn. Were they not let in on it? Did they
> just not bother to ask about it? It's a puzzlement.
Well, we can look both at CITY and at corroborating incidents from other eps
to try to piece the puzzle together. All evidence suggests that Tarrant is a
team player. He's happy, even eager, to discuss plans with his shipmates
(pirating the kairopan, investigating the space sarcophagus, going to the aid
of Auron, etc.) and he's willing to go along with whatever the majority
decides. So one might assume that he at least attempted to involve the
others in the mission to replace the crystals. And somehow or other he was
put in charge of finding replacement crystals. (Probably by default--no one
else wanted the job). Avon and Cally appeared to know the basics of the deal
with Norl, so one might also presume that Tarrant explained the situation to
the other. But, again, he was left with the responsibility of gaining Vila's
cooperation.
Presumably, Avon or Cally could have spoken up against the Keezarn plan any
time before or after the deal with Norl was made. They could have suggested
they try somewhere else for the crystals. They could have suggested that the
deal Tarrant negotiated wasn't acceptable. But they don't appear to have
done that, because Tarrant wouldn't have pressed the matter if the majority
(Avon-Cally-Vila) disagreed with him. It isn't until Vila has teleported to
the surface that Avon and Cally start to protest about how Tarrant handled
the matter. Too late to do Vila any good.
> But I look on City as
> occurring in a shakedown period of Tarrant's trying to get used to the
> Liberator crew dynamics. I agree he bullied Vila, although I think he did
> it for a good reason.
The interesting point is that Tarrant's bullying wasn't getting him anywhere
until he told Vila that the others wouldn't stop him if he decided to throw
Vila off the ship. That's when Vila stopped arguing. It wasn't so much
Tarrant's threat as a belief that
Avon and Cally would back Tarrant. Now why would Vila believe that Cally and
Avon would allow Tarrant to throw him off the ship? He must think neither of
them cares very much about him. He must think that neither of them would
protect him from Tarrant. Vila is on his own.
Which brings up something that occurred to me when we were reviewing CITY in
On the Wing. Cally, Avon and Tarrant seem to think that Vila didn't take the
tracer because he was terrified. Which isn't the least bit logical. If he
were afraid, wouldn't he want his shipmates to be able to find him? I think
Cally, Avon and Tarrant were wrong. I think Vila didn't take the tracer
because he was thinking about jumping ship. He didn't think anyone cared
about his welfare; he was tired of *everyone* giving him a hard time. So he
intended not to come back if he found good pickings on Keezarn. Vila's
behavior on Keezarn supports the theory that he wasn't terrified. He faces
down Bayban the Butcher with poise and equanimity. A lot of Vila's cowardly
posing was more to get out of work than genuine terror. Sure, he was
afraid--as any sensible person would be--but he wasn't as afraid as he would
have liked others to believe.
> It's pretty easy for
> even seasoned "people handlers" to regress to "Because I said so, dammit!"
You've been getting secret reports from my children, haven't you? :)
> Especially with someone as single-minded as Vila was being at that moment.
> Honestly, he was like a diabetic toddler wriggling around trying to get at
> an ice cream cone.
But a cute and appealing diabetic toddler.
> If Tarrant had been bullying Vila on a regular basis, I think we'd have
seen
> a lot more of it than we do.
And we would have seen more of a reaction from Vila. Vila wasn't shy about
showing his displeasure with shipmates who went beyond his level of
tolerance--per his skewering Avon with eyes and tongue after "Orbit" and
throughout the rest of the series.
Speaking of tolerance, I have to give our rebels credits for a lot of
patience and understanding. They were very tolerant of each other's
failings. If I were stuck in a closed environment with any of them for
longer than 48 hours, I'd be whipping out a chainsaw and engaging in creative
body sculpturing.
> I have to wonder if Vila hadn't begun to rethink his options here and
> decided he was better off on Liberator after all. The group of hardened
> thugs on Sardos were a pretty scary bunch, I'm betting. Especially after
> he'd been around them for awhile. Vila may have gotten used to not having
> to deal with those types on an everyday basis. Or maybe he even started
> feeling a bit guilty about having ducked out in the middle of the mission.
> I noticed at one point he was surreptitiously trying to readjust his
> teleport bracelet. Fun speculation!
Vila wasn't stupid. I don't think it took him long to decide that the
bastards he knew weren't such bad company after all. And a soft bed inside a
spaceship was preferable to a mat on the hard ground out in the elements. He
seemed quite ready to grab on to Tarrant again when the two of them were
reunited. No more protests that he didn't want to go along with Tarrant's
plans; no recriminations about Tarrant's earlier behavior.
> >Tarrant and Vila did get on each other's nerves. Vila doesn't like being
> >made to work, and Tarrant gets annoyed with Vila's laziness and habit of
> >getting drunk or sleeping on duty, but I don't think they disliked each
> >other; they are too comfortable in each other's presence for that.
Yep, they both realized that no one is perfect. If we only liked people who
never did anything that irritated us, we'd all be living solitary existences.
> More agreement. I doubt they were best friends or exchanging promise rings
> (well, unless I'm writing slash, that is), but I certainly didn't see the
> enmity in this relationship that some seem absolutely certain exists.
I like that idea, to have them exchange rings in a slash story. They can
wear them on chains around their necks.
Carol Mc
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 20:37:36 EDT
From: Mac4781@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Costume query
Message-ID: <ce4d5fba.24ba92d0@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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Sugar (quoting Lorna B):
> << I thought both of them looked like dogs in it, to be honest. It wasn't
> flattering to either man's body type. >>
>
> Agreed. I couldn't stand either of them in it. My main objection to it
is
> that it didn't fit the "image" of either man. I honestly couldn't see
that
> as something either of them would pick out to wear. Though I'm still
> confused as to how Tarrant wound up in it after he had teleported down.
My primary objection what that it literally didn't fit Tarrant. The arms
weren't long enough for a good fit. If it weren't my favorite
color--blue--it would be my least favorite Tarrant costume.
TigerM (quoting Sugar):
> >Though I'm still
> > confused as to how Tarrant wound up in it after he had teleported down
>
> He and Dayna swiped clothing from a couple of natives when they needed to
> disguise themselves to blend in on Helotrix. Avon on the other hand, must
> have chosen it himself out of the Liberator's infinite closet.
>
> Ohter recycled costumes in this episode included Vinni's quilted brown and
> white outfit from Death-Watch (Dayna wore that in Traitor), and the rebel
in
> the scene at the beginning (the one that got blown up) was wearing Max's
> outfit, also from Death-Watch.
IOW, used clothes were the rage on Helotrix. I'll bet they had the galaxy's
best Charity Shops. ;)
I'm guessing that Jenna was the one who donated the Blue Biker Shirt to
charity. She couldn't bear the thought of seeing it on Avon again.
The real puzzle is how did Dayna and Tarrant change back into their original
costumes in mid teleport? <g>
Carol Mc
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 22:59:53 EDT
From: SugarHIB7@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Lyst wars
Message-ID: <2c98a7d0.24bab429@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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<< Neil Faulkner wrote:
>> +ADw-a subtle appreciation of sarcasm and irony.+AD4-
>> And the recent discussions on Vila/Tarrant, to name but one of many
>> examples, suggest that some people haven't quite cultivated that
>> appreciation to a sufficient degree of subtlety.
< Mistral wrote:
> Erm...
> [Insert offensive phrase of choice here.]
Thank you. I have.
>Yes, I'd say you're getting a false impression. As Una's Q-study
> indicated, there are lots of different ways to approach B-7. What's
> going on in the characters' heads and how they relate to each
> other is one of them, as I'm sure you know.
After ten years of loving B7 on my own, to suddenly find another fan (not to
mention an entire GROUP) to share B7 views with, is a god-send. I've been
reading the archives and the current postings with fascination, and I'm
amazed and delighted by the widely varying views and opinions list members
have of the characters, AND of the events within the show. Sometimes I can't
believe everyone is watching the same show; the views are so "all over the
place". I especially find others' interpretations of the characters, and
their relationships with the other characters, extremely fascinating.
I welcome these discussions; I revel in them. I even plan to join in them
now that I'm familiar with how the list works. :)
I relish this opportunity to babble on about my favorite show and my
ever-lovin' adorable Avon. And I will defend him if I feel he's being
treated unjustly. If that equates to "rabid defences/analyses of various
characters" then feel free to accuse me of not having cultivated the subtle
appreciation of sarcasm and irony.
Sugar
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 17:55:48 -0700
From: Pat Patera <patpatera@netzero.net>
To: B7 Lysator <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Re: Re: Soolin (was Servalan)
Message-ID: <37893D14.CA427BE@netzero.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Kathryn Andersen wrote:
> (We're a wierd mob, aren't we? Still, I think it's better than
> distributing the characters body-parts, as some fandoms do...) (-8
erm, say wot?
Then again, maybe I don't want to know.
But I'll bet Penny does! :-)
Prying Pat
________________________________________________________
NetZero - We believe in a FREE Internet. Shouldn't you?
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 23:37:01 -0500
From: "Lorna B." <msdelta@magnolia.net>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: Tarrant and Vila (was Re: [B7L] Servalan)(long)
Message-Id: <199907120444.XAA18657@pemberton.magnolia.net>
Carol M. said:
>What do you mean "not over the moon in love with Tarrant"? I happen to
know
>that they were shagging in the aft cargo bay every chance they got. ;)
Ssshh! You don't want them finding out about that secret camera you've got
installed in said cargo bay!
>It should also be noted that Kool Hand Norl completely bamboozled Bayban
into
>thinking he was peaceful and cooperative. Tarrant wasn't the only one
fooled
>by Norl's act.
Kool Hand Norl. Heh. I like it. He was a sly old bastard, I'll give him
that. I loved the look on Norl's and Vila's faces when Vila accidentally
figured out the whole thing was a scam.
>Well, we can look both at CITY and at corroborating incidents from other
eps
>to try to piece the puzzle together. All evidence suggests that Tarrant is
a
>team player. He's happy, even eager, to discuss plans with his shipmates
>(pirating the kairopan, investigating the space sarcophagus, going to the
aid
>of Auron, etc.) and he's willing to go along with whatever the majority
>decides. So one might assume that he at least attempted to involve the
>others in the mission to replace the crystals. And somehow or other he was
>put in charge of finding replacement crystals. (Probably by default--no
one
>else wanted the job). Avon and Cally appeared to know the basics of the
deal
>with Norl, so one might also presume that Tarrant explained the situation
to
>the other. But, again, he was left with the responsibility of gaining
Vila's
>cooperation.
Yes, I must say that was my impression of the events as well. I also got
the impression that no one really wanted to be in charge of anything early
on in 3rd season. I'm not quite sure why. Kind of a reshuffling of roles
was taking place, I'd guess.
>Presumably, Avon or Cally could have spoken up against the Keezarn plan any
>time before or after the deal with Norl was made. They could have
suggested
>they try somewhere else for the crystals. They could have suggested that
the
>deal Tarrant negotiated wasn't acceptable. But they don't appear to have
>done that, because Tarrant wouldn't have pressed the matter if the majority
>(Avon-Cally-Vila) disagreed with him. It isn't until Vila has teleported
to
>the surface that Avon and Cally start to protest about how Tarrant handled
>the matter. Too late to do Vila any good.
Which was pretty convenient. It's a lot easier to gripe after the deed is
done.
>The interesting point is that Tarrant's bullying wasn't getting him
anywhere
>until he told Vila that the others wouldn't stop him if he decided to throw
>Vila off the ship. That's when Vila stopped arguing. It wasn't so much
>Tarrant's threat as a belief that
>Avon and Cally would back Tarrant. Now why would Vila believe that Cally
and
>Avon would allow Tarrant to throw him off the ship? He must think neither
of
>them cares very much about him. He must think that neither of them would
>protect him from Tarrant. Vila is on his own.
I think that is very telling. I wonder if something else was going on
between episodes before City occurred. Had Vila done something
spectacularly stupid (again) and incurred the wrath of the entire crew? Did
he believe he was so much on the outs with the lot of them that he really
thought he could be dumped without a qualm? This is interesting.
>Which brings up something that occurred to me when we were reviewing CITY
in
>On the Wing. Cally, Avon and Tarrant seem to think that Vila didn't take
the
>tracer because he was terrified. Which isn't the least bit logical. If he
>were afraid, wouldn't he want his shipmates to be able to find him? I
think
>Cally, Avon and Tarrant were wrong. I think Vila didn't take the tracer
>because he was thinking about jumping ship. He didn't think anyone cared
>about his welfare; he was tired of *everyone* giving him a hard time. So
he
>intended not to come back if he found good pickings on Keezarn.
My reaction to this theory is mixed. Part of me wants to believe Cally was
really tuned in to Vila and that he was terrified. But then another part of
me agrees with you on the reason he didn't take the tracer. Maybe Vila's
emotions were so strong at that moment that she misread him. Her empathic
abilities seem to vary an awful lot from ep to ep. I sometimes think he
didn't take the tracer as an act of defiance--like, "Well, I'll let you push
me into going on this mission, but I bloody well *won't* swallow your
infernal tracer! So there!"
>Vila's behavior on Keezarn supports the theory that he wasn't terrified.
He faces
>down Bayban the Butcher with poise and equanimity. A lot of Vila's
cowardly
>posing was more to get out of work than genuine terror. Sure, he was
>afraid--as any sensible person would be--but he wasn't as afraid as he
would
>have liked others to believe.
He did so well with Bayban that it quite warmed my little heart. It was fun
to see Vila coping on his own for a change, with no one to fall back upon.
>You've been getting secret reports from my children, haven't you? :)
Who, me? ;-)
>But a cute and appealing diabetic toddler.
Even with the immense cuteness, one still wants to slap him from time to
time.
>And we would have seen more of a reaction from Vila. Vila wasn't shy about
>showing his displeasure with shipmates who went beyond his level of
>tolerance--
Yes. Vila was a champion griper.
>per his skewering Avon with eyes and tongue after "Orbit" and
>throughout the rest of the series.
I got a naughty image from that use of "skewering," but I won't get further
into it on a family list. :-)
>Vila wasn't stupid. I don't think it took him long to decide that the
>bastards he knew weren't such bad company after all. And a soft bed inside
a
>spaceship was preferable to a mat on the hard ground out in the elements.
He
>seemed quite ready to grab on to Tarrant again when the two of them were
>reunited. No more protests that he didn't want to go along with Tarrant's
>plans; no recriminations about Tarrant's earlier behavior.
Yes, I noticed that too! Maybe Tarrant bossing him around proved to be
preferable to Servalan bossing him around. At least Tarrant didn't go
bashing him over the head with rocks. Though he probably *thought* about it
from time to time. ;-)
Lorna B.
"Cookies and porn? You're the best mom ever!"
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 03:39:23 EDT
From: AdamWho@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Servalan
Message-ID: <1304174d.24baf5ab@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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In a message dated 99-07-11 15:09:15 EDT, Louise.Rutter@btinternet.com writes:
<< Sara and Provine I can understand, though I wouldn't say I _hate_ either
of
them, but Tyce?!
Tyce is courageous, speaks her mind and takes action when she considers it
necessary even at risk to herslf. What's not to like? I wish we'd seen more
of her. >>
The character is like nails on a chalkboard for me, especially on repeat
viewing. I got so sick of the sneer she had on her face throughout the entire
episode. When she isn't sneering, she's being smug or pouting, or spitting
out every word she says. It's one of those characters that may have been
interesting on paper, but the actress pounds a very tiresome one-note into
the viewer's head every moment she's onscreen.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 01:21:02 -0700
From: mistral@ptinet.net
To: B7 List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Lyst wars
Message-ID: <3789A56E.9E419373@ptinet.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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SugarHIB7@aol.com wrote:
> I welcome these discussions; I revel in them. I even plan to join in them
> now that I'm familiar with how the list works. :)
Good on you :)
> I relish this opportunity to babble on about my favorite show and my
> ever-lovin' adorable Avon. And I will defend him if I feel he's being
> treated unjustly. If that equates to "rabid defences/analyses of various
> characters" then feel free to accuse me of not having cultivated the subtle
> appreciation of sarcasm and irony.
No worries. You just have to remember that some people
confuse an appreciation of sarcasm and irony with apathy
and the inability to say what you mean.
Grins,
Mistral
--
"We all have something to hide, and we all have something to tell;
we all have a secret name; we all have a secret question--
one question that unlocks our heart."--Galen, 'Crusade'
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 04:22:02 EDT
From: AdamWho@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: Tarrant and Vila (was Re: [B7L] Servalan)(long)
Message-ID: <1a81d1f3.24baffaa@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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In a message dated 99-07-11 20:07:27 EDT, Mac4781@aol.com writes:
<< Vila's
behavior on Keezarn supports the theory that he wasn't terrified. He faces
down Bayban the Butcher with poise and equanimity. A lot of Vila's cowardly
posing was more to get out of work than genuine terror. Sure, he was
afraid--as any sensible person would be--but he wasn't as afraid as he would
have liked others to believe. >>
Vila looked pretty terrified to me when Tarrant threatened him. Just because
Vila quickly adapted to the situation on Keezarn doesn't mean he felt any
less fear beforehand. I think the fear also came with a feeling of hurt and
disbelief. That a fellow crew-member, someone Vila's supposed to be on equal
footing with, is actually threatening to throw him off the ship if he doesn't
follow orders. Orders Tarrant never bothered to consult Vila about until
after he'd made the deal. Knowing the others didn't care enough to stand up
to Tarrant probably made Vila feel even worse. The part that annoys me is
Tarrant showing initial signs of respect for Vila toward the end of City, but
going back to the bullying in Moloch.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 04:24:36 EDT
From: AdamWho@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Costume query
Message-ID: <6f9ebcbc.24bb0044@aol.com>
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In a message dated 99-07-11 20:39:54 EDT, Mac4781@aol.com writes:
<< The real puzzle is how did Dayna and Tarrant change back into their
original
costumes in mid teleport? <g> >>
The same way Tyce changed her clothes on board the Liberator in "Bounty". I
never understood that. Do you think she wanted an outfit to match the color
of the death collar?
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 11:38:07 +0200
From: Angria@t-online.de (Tanja Kinkel)
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Message-Id: <m113cXH-0006CqC@fwd00.btx.dtag.de>
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AdamWho@aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 99-07-11 15:09:15 EDT, Louise.Rutter@btinternet.com writes:
>
> << Sara and Provine I can understand, though I wouldn't say I _hate_ either
> of
> them, but Tyce?!
> Tyce is courageous, speaks her mind and takes action when she considers it
> necessary even at risk to herslf. What's not to like? I wish we'd seen more
> of her. >>
>
> The character is like nails on a chalkboard for me, especially on repeat
> viewing. I got so sick of the sneer she had on her face throughout the entire
> episode. When she isn't sneering, she's being smug or pouting, or spitting
> out every word she says. It's one of those characters that may have been
> interesting on paper, but the actress pounds a very tiresome one-note into
> the viewer's head every moment she's onscreen.
Come on Adam, be fair. The actress obviously took her cue from Paul Darrow as
Avon, who certainly is guilty of the charge of sneering, being smug, pouting
and/or spitting out every word as well, and creates a compelling result. <g>
Seriously now, Tyce wasn't my favourite guest character, either, but I liked her
well enough and wonder how the story would have worked without her (as it was
originally written - Tyce was Chris Boucher's addition to Terry Nation's
script). My first choice for a truly annoying guest character would be Jarvik,
with his Tarzan speeches, but then I hate Ben Steed episodes anyway, so...
Tanja
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 05:55:04 EDT
From: AdamWho@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Message-ID: <7077f569.24bb1578@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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In a message dated 99-07-12 05:39:42 EDT, Angria@t-online.de writes:
<< Seriously now, Tyce wasn't my favourite guest character, either, but I
liked her
well enough and wonder how the story would have worked without her (as it
was
originally written - Tyce was Chris Boucher's addition to Terry Nation's
script). >>
I don't know, did Tyce ever really make a big impact in the story? She
guarded Sarkoff, she went onto the Liberator with him, she screamed at Jenna
(a less forgiving person would've pushed that button to activate the death
collar), and flirted with Blake at the end. The only Tyce scenes I liked were
a few with Sarkoff toward the end, when we found out they were father and
daughter.
<< My first choice for a truly annoying guest character would be Jarvik,
with his Tarzan speeches, but then I hate Ben Steed episodes anyway, so... >>
My first choice is either Provine, one of the truly one-dimensional and
uninteresting B7 villians, the three deliriously over the top royal siblings
from The Keeper, or Blake's twitty cousin Inga. Maybe a three-way tie.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 05:52:56 -0400
From: Harriet Monkhouse <101637.2064@compuserve.com>
To: "INTERNET:blakes7@lysator.liu.se" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Cally's humour (was Re: [B7L] Re: Soolin (was Servalan))
Message-ID: <199907120553_MC2-7CA7-8AA7@compuserve.com>
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charset=ISO-8859-1
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Pat Patera wrote:
>Cally is surely the most humorless character in the entire series.
> Does she ever joke or even crack a smile?
Good heavens, yes. All her banter with Blake about the door in Star One,
her sly dig at Avon in City (something like "No one's perfect." "But I
thought you were..."), her teasing of Vila in Deathwatch...
Harriet
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 11:26:08 +0100
From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Message-ID: <004101becc50$fbfa2fc0$0d01a8c0@hedge>
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Adam responded:
> << My first choice for a truly annoying guest character would be Jarvik,
> with his Tarzan speeches, but then I hate Ben Steed episodes anyway, so...
>>
>
> My first choice is either Provine, one of the truly one-dimensional and
> uninteresting B7 villians, the three deliriously over the top royal
siblings
> from The Keeper, or Blake's twitty cousin Inga. Maybe a three-way tie.
I like Provine. I think he's a good villain. I like the way that he seems to
be a fairly run-of-the-mill sort of officer, and yet he's capable of quite
coldly committing this terrible atrocity by denonating the bomb thingy. Says
a bit about how the Federation trains its soldiers.
Inga, however, needs a slap.
Una
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 12:55:26 +0200
From: Angria@t-online.de (Tanja Kinkel)
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Message-Id: <m113dk6-0003QXC@fwd12.btx.dtag.de>
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AdamWho@aol.com schrieb:
> I don't know, did Tyce ever really make a big impact in the story? She
> guarded Sarkoff, she went onto the Liberator with him, she screamed at Jenna
> (a less forgiving person would've pushed that button to activate the death
> collar), and flirted with Blake at the end. The only Tyce scenes I liked were
> a few with Sarkoff toward the end, when we found out they were father and
> daughter.
One of the good Tyce scenes comes fairly early, when she disarms Blake, but also
is willing to hear him out, so Our Hero can FINALLY explain he isn't there to
kill Sarkoff. (Don't tell me you weren't relieved when this stopped Sarkoff's
monologue on how he has accepted to be assassinated.) Tyce deciding to go with
Blake & Cally is certainly as much an incentive to Sarkoff for going with them
as well as Blake's threat to his record collection. She contributes to their
escape from the castle, she refuses to let her father sink into self-pity and
passivity, and she is his reason for killing what's-his-name, Jenna's former
friend. Last but not least, her short flirt with Blake caused the one and only
time where we see both Jenna and Cally (whose sense of humour has been
questioned recently) teasing Blake on screen. I wish they had done that more
often.
Tanja
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 03:56:54 PDT
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Message-ID: <19990712105654.29615.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
<My first choice for a truly annoying guest character would be Jarvik,
with his Tarzan speeches, but then I hate Ben Steed episodes anyway, so... >
For me it's Piri/Cancer. Talk about suspension of disbelief, I still can't
believe that the story wasn't brought to a grinding halt when Avon shot her
fifteen minutes after *meeting* her...
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 04:20:21 -0700
From: mistral@ptinet.net
To: B7 List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Message-ID: <3789CF75.8B34E51@ptinet.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sally Manton wrote:
> <My first choice for a truly annoying guest character would be Jarvik,
> with his Tarzan speeches, but then I hate Ben Steed episodes anyway, so... >
>
> For me it's Piri/Cancer. Talk about suspension of disbelief, I still can't
> believe that the story wasn't brought to a grinding halt when Avon shot her
> fifteen minutes after *meeting* her...
Er, don't you mean five?
For me, I think it's Governor LeGrand.
Mistral
--
"We all have something to hide, and we all have something to tell;
we all have a secret name; we all have a secret question--
one question that unlocks our heart."--Galen, 'Crusade'
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 07:29:35 EDT
From: Mac4781@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: Tarrant and Vila (was Re: [B7L] Servalan)(long)
Message-ID: <f923b0a6.24bb2b9f@aol.com>
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Lorna B. wrote:
> Kool Hand Norl. Heh. I like it. He was a sly old bastard, I'll give him
> that. I loved the look on Norl's and Vila's faces when Vila accidentally
> figured out the whole thing was a scam.
That's a great moment, performed with great skill by two very fine actors.
Vila quickly sussed out that there was more to Norl than met the eye. Vila
had a talent for recognizing deviousness, maybe because he also had a talent
for being devious. It's not something his shipmates took advantage of often
enough. They could have used Vila for a trustmeter. "Shall we make a deal
with the Terra Nostra/Zukan/etc.?" "Not unless they pass the Vila test." I
suppose one reason they didn't use Vila in that manner is because he might
have pronounced anyone untrustworthy if he didn't like the risks that
accompanied the scheme in question.
I also love the Vila-Sherm exchange that happens after the Norl-Vila bit.
Sherm is so outclassed that one can almost feel sorry for him.
> Yes, I must say that was my impression of the events as well. I also got
> the impression that no one really wanted to be in charge of anything early
> on in 3rd season. I'm not quite sure why. Kind of a reshuffling of roles
> was taking place, I'd guess.
I've pondered that myself. Did Avon think Blake might return and he didn't
see the point of assuming leadership if it was going to be snatched back out
of his hands? Or was he pretty sure Blake wouldn't return and he was
reluctant to take on permanent leadership responsibility?
I do find the dynamics interesting.
> I think that is very telling. I wonder if something else was going on
> between episodes before City occurred. Had Vila done something
> spectacularly stupid (again) and incurred the wrath of the entire crew?
Did
> he believe he was so much on the outs with the lot of them that he really
> thought he could be dumped without a qualm? This is interesting.
That's a possibility. I'd honestly rather hope for an isolated incident
estrangement than to think Vila believed no one on the ship--including
longtime associates Avon and Cally--cared a fiddle about his welfare. They
genuinely seemed to care about him when he was in trouble in DAWN. But he
might not have assumed that to be personal concern, but rather more pragmatic
"we shouldn't lose our favorite piece of cannon fodder if we can help it; it
would be wasteful" concern.
Vila could get disconsolate on occasion. He tossed out those lines in Sand:
"If I died it'd be a real joke. Who'd care? Who cared about Cally?"
> I sometimes think he
> didn't take the tracer as an act of defiance--like, "Well, I'll let you
push
> me into going on this mission, but I bloody well *won't* swallow your
> infernal tracer! So there!"
I could believe that. It would go along with the mood of a diabetic toddler
that you noted. Someone stamping his foot and slyly attempting to get back
at the "grown-ups." "You can make me do x, but you can't make me do y.
Nyah, nyah, nyah." All of us have a need to be in control. And that gave
Vila some degree of control. It wasn't the smartest thing to do, but biting
off one's nose to spite one's face is a normal human reaction. :)
> He did so well with Bayban that it quite warmed my little heart. It was
fun
> to see Vila coping on his own for a change, with no one to fall back upon.
He usually did cope well on his own. He didn't mind using the others as
crutches when they were around, but there was nothing wrong with his legs. I
loved how he took charge when Liberator was dissolving around him and Dayna.
There was no hesitancy. He must have been afraid, but he set his fears
aside. He even kept his poise when Servalan and company showed up; he
snatched Orac right out from under their noses.
> Even with the immense cuteness, one still wants to slap him from time to
> time.
That's true for all of them. Even mature Gan. Not telling his shipmates
about the limiter wasn't the smart thing to do. But I can understand why
he'd be reluctant to talk about it.
> I got a naughty image from that use of "skewering,"
I would have been disappointed in you if you hadn't. :)
Carol Mc
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 21:57:54 +1000
From: "Trevor Gensch" <timelord@mail.cth.com.au>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: RE: [B7L] You know you've watched too much B7 when...
Message-ID: <000501becc5d$c67a9620$c2d01dcb@signup>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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I obviously do not think about B7 much. Who the heck is Carnell?
Tre.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: J MacQueen [mailto:jomacqueen@yahoo.com]
> Sent: Thursday, July 01, 1999 12:03
> To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
> Subject: [B7L] You know you've watched too much B7 when...
>
>
>
> ...A headline on the Sydney Morning Herald's website
> says "Carnell given two month lifeline" and you don't
> immediately think of the Chief Minister for the
> Australian Capital Territory. Sorry. I need to catch
> up on more sleep than I thought I needed to.
>
> Regards
> Joanne
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
>
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 21:57:43 +1000
From: "Trevor Gensch" <timelord@mail.cth.com.au>
To: "Lysator List" <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: RE: [B7L] Another door closes
Message-ID: <000001becc5d$c0af6ea0$c2d01dcb@signup>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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Are there contact details for these two fellows?
I am new to the world of online Blake fandom.
Trev.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Judith Proctor [mailto:Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk]
> Sent: Saturday, July 03, 1999 7:14
> To: Lysator List
> Subject: RE: [B7L] Another door closes
>
>
> On Fri 02 Jul, Trevor Gensch wrote:
> > That is so sad. To be perfectly honest, I didn't even know it
> existed :-)
> >
> > what other Aussie B7/sci fi mags are there out there that could
> do with some
> > contributions? If i knew they were around I would submit something!
>
> Chronicles. I think Andrew Williams is editing that now.
>
> Kathryn Andersen likes to get B7 stuff for her multimedia zine
> Refractions.
>
> judith
>
> --
> http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 - Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs,
> pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth
> Thomas, etc. (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.nas.com/~lknight)
>
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 21:57:52 +1000
From: "Trevor Gensch" <timelord@mail.cth.com.au>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: RE: [B7L] Ultraworld Question
Message-ID: <000401becc5d$c57ed100$c2d01dcb@signup>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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I don't know whether they were or not, but they do look similar to the
tunnels used in the Doctor Who adventure 'The Sun Makers'.
Trev.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: AdamWho@aol.com [mailto:AdamWho@aol.com]
> Sent: Monday, July 05, 1999 3:58
> To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
> Subject: [B7L] Ultraworld Question
>
>
> Anyone know if the tunnels Dayna and Tarrant ran though during Ultraworld
> were used in The Fixx video "One Thing Leads to Another"?
>
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 21:57:51 +1000
From: "Trevor Gensch" <timelord@mail.cth.com.au>
To: "Blake's7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: RE: [B7L] Query
Message-ID: <000301becc5d$c47b6ac0$c2d01dcb@signup>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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>
> (If you don't mind moving away from Servalan for a moment)
> Can any of you good people tell me whether there is a Dr. Who discussion
> group similar to this B7 list? I'd appreciate any helpful info.
Yep, sure is
There is one called DRWHO-L. Well worth a look now that the other mailing
list for Doctor Who (Allen Road) appears to be going thru hard times and has
had people leaving in droves.
Send an email to listproc@lists.pipex.com
with this as the subject line
SUBSCRIBE DRWHO-L Firstname Lastname
Where Firstname is your.... firstname... and Lastname is your... ahem..
lastname.
Trev.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 13:32:28 +0100
From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] You know you've watched too much B7 when...
Message-ID: <003201becc62$aa1448f0$0d01a8c0@hedge>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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Trev asked:
> I obviously do not think about B7 much. Who the heck is Carnell?
The highlight of the episode 'Weapon'.
Una
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 13:33:30 +0100
From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
To: "Blake's7" <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Query
Message-ID: <003b01becc62$d06824e0$0d01a8c0@hedge>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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Trev said:
> SUBSCRIBE DRWHO-L Firstname Lastname
>
> Where Firstname is your.... firstname... and Lastname is your... ahem..
> lastname.
All sounds a bit tricky to me...
Una
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 01:48:20 -0600
From: "Ellynne G." <rilliara@juno.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Re: Warm and fuzzy (was Soolin)
Message-ID: <19990518.022327.9926.0.Rilliara@juno.com>
On Sun, 11 Jul 1999 15:59:38 -0700 mistral@ptinet.net writes:
>It would be rather silly to think that Liberator/Scorpio crew all felt
>warm and fuzzy about each other, all of the time.
Hmm, all feeling warm and fuzzy about each other. All the time.
I see a story here, one where Avon is going nuts as everyone is acting
warm and fuzzy. All the time. Either they've all finally had enough of
him and are trying to drive him insane in the meanest way possible or
they've been taken over by evil aliens called Care Bears
Ellynne
___________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 13:10:28 +0100
From: Julia Jones <julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Cc: B7 List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Costume query
Message-ID: <qMjqXQA0sdi3Ewga@jajones.demon.co.uk>
In message <37892C93.A0841B18@ptinet.net>, mistral@ptinet.net writes
>Next question: I know some of you have seen it in person; is
>it blue? and are they studs or buttons?
>
Having seen it at Deliverance - it's deep blue. The studs are studs, and
hexagonal shaped, not round.
It's well worth getting the Deliverance Exhibition Catalogue, even if it
does describe the lobster suit as "one of the favourites for Avon fans".
Yes, I know I'm imfamous for drooling over the trousers - the
*trousers*, not the suit.
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 07:24:53 +0100 (BST)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Costume query
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.46-0712062453-0b0Rr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
On Mon 12 Jul, mistral@ptinet.net wrote:
> Next question: I know some of you have seen it in person; is
> it blue? and are they studs or buttons?
More black than blue, but I do seem to recall a trace of blue in it. They're
studs - long hexagonal ones.
Judith
--
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 - Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs,
pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth
Thomas, etc. (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.nas.com/~lknight)
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 18:33:34 +0100
From: Julia Jones <julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: space-city@world.std.com, blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] B7 newsgroup
Message-ID: <nEn+5WAubii3Ewx8@jajones.demon.co.uk>
Demon have added the newsgroup to their feed, so some more of us can get
it now. It's also available via Deja, for those willing to read online.
Yet another group of people apparently blissfully unaware that theirs is
not the only B7 discussion group on the net, to judge by a couple of the
posts I've seen.
c.c.ed to Space city. For the Citizens who aren't on the Lyst -
Dangermouse reported last night that alt.fan.blakes-7 had emerged from
the depths of Usenet.
--
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1999 12:36:23 -0500
From: "Lorna B." <msdelta@magnolia.net>
To: <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Tyce (was: Servalan)
Message-Id: <199907121743.MAA08576@pemberton.magnolia.net>
Una said:
>I like Provine. I think he's a good villain. I like the way that he seems
to
>be a fairly run-of-the-mill sort of officer, and yet he's capable of quite
>coldly committing this terrible atrocity by denonating the bomb thingy.
Says
>a bit about how the Federation trains its soldiers.
Yes! I liked Provine as well, nicely played by Paul Shelley. Something
about him just chilled the blood. In some ways, he seemed to epitomize the
ruthlessness of the Federation.
>Inga, however, needs a slap.
Actually, I thought Inga just needed a new wardrobe. Here we're told Exbar
is a pretty chilly planet, and they have her running around in one of
Leela's rejected leather leotards. One of the reasons she was fairly feisty
with the crimos is probably that she was just trying to keep warm.
Lorna B.
"Cookies and porn? You're the best mom ever!"
--------------------------------
End of blakes7-d Digest V99 Issue #216
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